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Identifying protocol/device # for a Revox B260 Tuner
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Eiffel



Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 23
Location: MD

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:44 pm    Post subject: Identifying protocol/device # for a Revox B260 Tuner Reply with quote

Hi,

I would like to use my extended RS 15-2116 to control a Revox B260 tuner, but can't find the codes or protocol to use.

The IR codes are easily learned by my remote. For instance the following corresponds to keys 0,1,2 and Enter

[0]
+20 -456 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -456 +20 -131070

[1]
+20 -456 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -456 +20 -131070

[2]
+20 -456 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -456 +20 -131070

[Enter]
+20 -456 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -296 +20 -138 +20 -138 +20 -296 +20 -456 +20 -131070

In the past, I was also able to teach my Pronto to use these codes (My CCF file was the base for the Revox B260 codes one can find at Remote central)... but DecodeIR refuses to recognize these codes as learned codes (They appear to use a raw unmodulated code, rather than the more common oscillated code which may be part of the issue).

Could someone help me with this issue as I don't know how to proceed from here.

TIA

RueFondary
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Mark Pierson
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Joined: 03 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You should upload a copy of the saved IR file with the learned signals to the diagnosis area and post a link to it here. Be sure to read the Posting Links message (below).
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just what I was going to say. We can't even get the frequency from just the posted times.
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Eiffel



Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 23
Location: MD

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry for not having abided by the #1 Code Search FAQ Embarassed

Here's the information on the device I'm trying to use (ultimately with an extended remote)

1. Device: Revox B208 remote
2. Type of device: Multiple (B260 Tuner, B250 integrated amp, B226/225 CD, Revox Tape player, Revox Turntable, etc.)
3. Remote model: RS 15-2116, 2117 and 1994
4. JP1 user? Yes
5. Still have original remote? Yes (B208)
6. Checked Yahoo file section? Yes
7. Checked Pronto file section Yes (I'm the source for the file there, which was taught to my pronto using the original Revox remote)

I do remember the CCF file to work well (my JP1 remotes can learn these signals very easily too), but IRTools or other 'CCF compatible' applications do not recognize the codes that the Pronto has learned

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jp1/files/Diagnosis%20Area/Revox%20B208%20Remote.IR

Thanks in advance for looking into this

RueFondary
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a link to Eiffel's Revox B260 CCF file. There's also a CCF file there for the Revox Evolution.

The learned signals in IR.exe all show up as having a frequency of 0 and using the pid_002A protocol. I've not dealt with this protocol before, but as it shows up I'm guessing that John Fine has come across it before. Do these learned signals actually work?

Reading between the lines, and having done a Google search on this, I think the Revox R208 is a remote that comes with several Revox devices and is able to control other Revox devices, not just the one that it came with. There are also other Revox remotes that send the same signals as the R208.

Therefore the answers to the first 2 template questions should be:

1. Device: Revox B260 (ie, the Revox device are you trying to control)
2. Type of device: tuner

The point is, you're not trying to control the R208 remote, you're trying to control a device that the R208 is also able to control.
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Eiffel



Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 23
Location: MD

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob,

Eiffel is my username on many HTPC forums, so I'm intimately familiar with the CCF you're referring to Wink. Unfortunately, as stated above, the pronto codes in said CCF can't be understood by IRTools Sad

The Revox evolution uses a very different protocol, and the CCF for that device doesn't work with my tuner.

The learned signals in the .IR file I posted today do work very well with the tuner (I wouldn't have posted them otherwise)

I see your point about the device I want to control being a B260 (although I also have a B250 amplifier and a B266 CD, which I may one day try to control with one of my JP1 remotes).

RueFondary
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eiffel wrote:
Rob, Eiffel is my username on many HTPC forums, so I'm intimately familiar with the CCF you're referring to.

I know it's your file, I was just providing a link to it because you didn't. People are more likely to look at things when links are provided.
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johnsfine
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm once again on the wrong computer for checking such things well. But I don't see anything in those CCF files matching the pid_2A signals in that IR file.

IrTool would not be able to understand those pid_2A signals, but DecodeCCF would. Eiffel, you should be using DecodeCCF, not IrTool for decoding CCF file contents.

I'm sure KM can produce an upgrade for pid_2A. I don't have info handy on how the fixed data should work (maybe Rob does). But I probably put EFC numbers in the decode after checking how pid_2A works, so that part is likely to be easy.
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Eiffel



Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 23
Location: MD

PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for your help. Here's the result from running DecodeCCF:

Code:
Protocol   Device   SubDev   OBC   EFC   Misc   Decode   UDB   Function   Sequence   Key   Panel   DevName   TopFreq   Once   Rept
pid_002A   28      56   013   27/158/320/479   0_14      Learned      P-type   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   42   0
pid_002A   28      56   013   27/162/320/479   14_14      Learned      P-type   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   42   0
pid_002A   28      56   013   27/158/320/476   28_14      Learned      P-type   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   42   0
pid_002A   28      17   113   23/159/315/474         Learned      1   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      18   111   27/158/317/476   0_14      Learned      2   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      18   111   27/158/317/476   14_14      Learned      2   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      19   115   26/156/315/474         Learned      3   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      20   108   23/159/315/474         Learned      4   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      21   112   27/158/317/476   0_14      Learned      5   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      21   112   27/158/317/476   14_14      Learned      5   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      22   110   27/158/317/476   0_14      Learned      6   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      22   110   27/162/320/476   14_14      Learned      6   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      25   241   26/156/315/474         Learned      9   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      24   237   26/156/315/474         Learned      8   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      23   114   27/158/320/479         Learned      7   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      39   210   27/158/320/479         Learned      `C9   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      26   239   27/158/320/479         Learned      0   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      37   208   27/158/317/476         Learned      Style Dn   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   28      38   206   27/158/320/479   0_14      Learned      Style Up   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      38   206   27/158/317/476   14_14      Learned      Style Up   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   18      38   206   23/159/315/474         Learned      Station Up   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0
pid_002A   18      37   208   27/158/320/479   0_14      Learned      Station dn   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   18      37   208   27/162/320/476   14_14      Learned      Station dn   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   28   0
pid_002A   28      0   173   26/159/315/471         Learned      Power off   Tuner - Play   HOME   H   0   14   0




I would appreciate some pointers as to how to proceed. Embarassed

Eiffel
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johnsfine
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry. I started to check the KM support for pid_002A but realized your signals aren't pid_002A. They have a structure similar enough to pid_002A to fool my decoder, but not close enough for a pid_002A upgrade to work.

I'll need to research a little more (you seem to have picked a harder than typical example).
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johnsfine
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any experts lurking who know what Protocol 00DC is, or have time to do an upgrade for it and remote-to-remote learn and check?

The info I have and half understand regarding Protocol 00DC says that it is the protocol used by these learned signals.

KM does let you select "pid: 00 DC" as a protocol and I assume gives you a correct upgrade for it.

Edit: Then again, I just tried entering an OBC in a KM upgrade for pid 00 DC and it generated a two byte hex command. I really think pid 00DC uses one byte hex commands, so the KM entry fo it must be wrong.

Edit2: The generated protocol is missing the "00 00" at the beginning indicating "no modulation". I think that error indirectly causes the error in hex command. I don't know how to edit the hidden parts of KM. Maybe Rob or Mark will double check my analysis of this and fix it for us soon.
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think John totally nailed it with the $00DC call. Eiffel, here's an upgrade for you to try, the buttons are mapped to exactly the same buttons that you learned them to (except +100 which I moved to the LAST button)

Upgrade Code 0 = 67 D0 (Cable/2000) Revox B260 Tuner (KM v8.30)
DC 00 CE FE 78 49 C7 A4 74 B4 34 D4 54 94 14 E4
64 88 08 D0 B0 20 E0 80 70 98 58 58 98 28 9C FC
C8 48 10 90
End

Upgrade Protocol 0 = 00 DC (S3C8+) Custom Protocol for Cable/2000 Revox B260 Tuner (KM v8.30)
00 00 11 8B 13 C5 E5 40 05 06 00 0A 00 42 00 0A
00 A2 E2 85 00 0A 01 04 76 03 01 EB 03 46 2B 01
8D 01 49
End

If this works, I'll give you the KM file.
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Eiffel



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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you very much for your help!

It will be a few more days before I can try the upgrade protocol and device descriptions, but I'll report the results of my testing ASAP

I must say how you define/create these protocols is a complete mystery to me Wink

Eiffel
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, in cases like this it is a bit more tricky, but that's only because the signal is an unusual one that isn't supported by our tools. Normally the process is alot simpler.

In this case you were helped by John Fine's keen eyes in spotting that your signals match the $00DC protocol, and luckily the device codes and OBCs reported by IR were right for that protocol too, so setting up KM to re-produce it was pretty easy.

We even found a KM bug in the process!
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johnsfine
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob, I didn't dig into your upgrade above, but what did you do about the two commands that have a different device number.

I thought the device/OBC bit boundary in 00DC was the same as in the decode and was correct (based on the pattern of numbers here and in related CCF files).

If we were inventing 00DC from scratch knowing this, we'd probably make it a standard mini-combo (since there are 6 function bits). But it looks like UEI didn't.

I expect that leaves the best choice of making an empty upgrade to define device 18 and then referencing that upgrade as external functions from the main upgrade, so KM creates the two KeyMoves.

Am I missing something, or does that need to be added after testing confirms that we're on the right track?
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