Pioneer PDP 5016HD decoding problems

Gator · Post by **Gator** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 6:49 am

You must add the numbers button in your upgrade.

Try this upgrade

Upgrade Code 0 = 07 D4 (Cable/2004) Pioneer PDP 5080HD (RM v1.78)
5A 00 90 00 21 00 AA AA 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 C7 37
End

I just added a dummy number on the zero.

Geir

johnsfine · Post by **johnsfine** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 6:58 am

Gator wrote:You must add the numbers button in your upgrade.

Why?

Are you just solving the problem that IR doesn't know how to display an upgrade that is too small? That problem should not affect the behavior of the upgrade in the remote.

Or do you have reason to believe that RM creates upgrades incorrectly for the 9960 B01 when no digits are include? Small upgrades without digits that RM creates for other models (that IR displayes incorrectly) do work.

I looked at the files in that .zip and I don't see the reason that upgrade didn't work. I don't have a 9960, so I can't do any meaningful testing.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 7:07 am

Gator wrote:You must add the numbers button in your upgrade.

Try this upgrade

Upgrade Code 0 = 07 D4 (Cable/2004) Pioneer PDP 5080HD (RM v1.78)
5A 00 90 00 21 00 AA AA 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 C7 37
End

I just added a dummy number on the zero.

Geir

I'm almost certain that will make the upgrade long enough to stop IR showing the fixed data as a button hex code.

I'm confident of that, because I did that (threw in a number key) when I was playing with the files earlier in the thread, and it cured the IR upgrade display issue.

But will it also make the upgrade work ?

Only klflote can tell us that.

If it does then there must be more going on here than IR displaying short upgrades incorrectly.

If it doesn't then we need to work out why the device is not responding to this upgrade, when by all accounts it should.

I could also repeat my earlier question if we get that far - is it worth trying a Pioneer protocol instead of NEC1 - I'm not expert enough to know how much of a difference that would make.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 7:12 am

Seems we posted at the same time, John.

I hadn't read your response because I was still (slowly) typing mine.

I can't find anything obviously amiss in the posted files either - seems like they "should" work.

At least the learned signal problem is solved.

I reckon unclemiltie would be the man for this...

edit: I've taken the liberty of PM'ing him

Gator · Post by **Gator** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 7:19 am

johnsfine wrote:
Gator wrote:You must add the numbers button in your upgrade.
Why?

Are you just solving the problem that IR doesn't know how to display an upgrade that is too small? That problem should not affect the behavior of the upgrade in the remote.

Or do you have reason to believe that RM creates upgrades incorrectly for the 9960 B01 when no digits are include? Small upgrades without digits that RM creates for other models (that IR displays incorrectly) do work.

I looked at the files in that .zip and I don't see the reason that upgrade didn't work. I don't have a 9960, so I can't do any meaningful testing.

I was only playing around with it, and discovered that when you added the numbers, IR showed the fixed data correctly. So i assumed that was the problem.

Post by **The Robman** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 8:53 am

It would really be helpful if there were more than just two learned signals to judge this signal by. Could you learn all of the buttons and post the resulting IR files. When you learn buttons that don't have a logical equivilent on the URC, add a note next to the button in the IR file stating what it really is.

unclemiltie · Post by **unclemiltie** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:15 am

Isn't the data from the upgrade in RM not correct:

The power and input keys are the first keys in the list for the TV device, so with a digit map, no vol keys, no channel keys and the first two keys, the key bitmap should look like 1001 1001

Thus, the upgrade should be

5A 00 19 00 99 C7 37
instead of
5A 00 19 00 AA AA C7 37

5A is protocol
00 i can't remember what this one is
19 is the digit table entry
00 is the fixed data
99 is the key bitmap
and C7=the first key=power
37= the second key = input

If you type this in manually to RM, the keys get mapped correctly

something is going wrong in RM for this upgrade.... greg?

Mark Pierson · Post by **Mark Pierson** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:26 am

5A 00 19 00 AA AA C7 37 is the correct code for this upgrade as far as I can tell.

5A = pid
00 = digit table entry
19 = button bitmap
00 AA AA = fixed data (NEC1 uses 3 bytes of fixed data)
C7 = 1st key (power)
37 = 2nd key (input)

Post by **The Robman** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:38 am

KM produces the same output, so I think the upgrade itself is OK. However, there are timing differences between the standard NEC1 signal and the learned signals.

If you drop the following protocol upgrade into the remote, it will (hopefully) adjust the timings to match those found in the learned signals.

Upgrade protocol 0 = 00 5A (S3C8+) PB v4.00
43 8B 31 8B 12 CF 44 08 08 01 18 01 06 01 18 03
39 B5 A4 10 9A 08 52 20 01 08 03 37 04 15 F6 01
46 FB 10 37 0B 07 E4 05 04 60 05 8B 0E B6 04 80
B6 05 80 37 0B 05 E4 04 05 60 05 E4 06 07 60 07
20 11 37 06 05 F6 01 04 7B 12 37 09 15 37 02 06
F6 01 49 F6 01 46 37 01 03 46 29 0D 46 29 01 8D
01 49 E4 20 1E E4 21 1F 37 01 EB F6 01 49 E6 28
C1 60 04 E6 12 01 8B E4
End

binky123 · Post by **binky123** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:40 am

IR may not display the fixed data bytes correctly if the fixed data > var bytes. The Devices Tabsheet in IR has a small input box in the upper right corner labelled Max Var Size. Enter 1 into this box and the fixed bytes of 00 AA AA will appear and Power=C7 and Input=37.

Post by **The Robman** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:43 am

binky123 wrote:The Devices Tabsheet in IR has a small input box in the upper right corner labelled Max Var Size.

Cool, I hadn't noticed that before.

klflote · Post by **klflote** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 7:46 pm

Yet more progress....

I've uploaded the new protocol supplied by Rob, and now the two signals work. What's more, I went and learned all the signals, and all the signals that use NEC 1 protocol for device 170 work.

But there are a bunch of signals that use NEC 1 protocol on device 0 subdevice 134, which apparently isn't unusual. However, I have the same problem with those: they don't work when loaded in via an upgrade (even if I also use Rob's new protocol upgrade).

I also tried an upgrade using the NEC 1 combo protocol with all the learned signals, but it didn't work -- even with Rob's protocol upgrade.

So now I'm back to looking for how to get the device 0 protocol to work, and then presumably I can use the device combiner protocol to create an upgrade for the entire remote. [It isn't immediately obvious to me how to store the protocol upgrade in the .rdmu file -- apparently I can use KM and a manual sheet to store Rob's protocol upgrade? But that's looking ahead a little.]

I've uploaded the learned signals for the device 0 commands and related info to http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... le_id=5026
But if there's a way I can figure out what the protocol upgrade should be, I'm happy to try -- I rummaged around a little for information, but didn't find anything. So any pointers are welcome.

This has all been extremely helpful -- thanks everyone!

PS: If you're following closely, you'll see that the new files refer to the Pioneer 5016, not the 5080. A mental block prevented me from remembering that although we planned for months to buy a 5080, we substituted the cheaper 5016 at the last minute. So the device is actually a 5016HD.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:29 pm

Ok, you nearly fooled me.

The timings in the second set of learns looked identical to the first set.

I could see no reason Rob's tweaked protocol wouldn't work...

Until I realised you'd set your RM upgrade as DEVICE 134:SUBDEVICE 0

instead of DEVICE:0 SUBDEVICE 134

I'm pretty confident it will work if you correct that slip up

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:58 am

@Rob:

For completeness, do you think that now this is proved as a solution, your "tweaked" protocol should use a different ID than the common NEC1, in case klflote wants to use "genuine" NEC1 for other devices in future, and those devices don't like the revised timings which this override will generate?

Or would it be easier to apply the revisions you made to an NEC1 2Dev Combo protocol upgrade and use that to cover the 2 device/subdevices in use ?

edit: I went ahead and created a 2DEV upgrade, here:
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... le_id=5027
but I think it won't work until the Upgrade Protocol output is tweaked to match what Rob did above
note that I didn't do any key mapping other than auto-assign, so you'll need to put functions on the keys you want them.

You could also use Device Combiner as you mentioned, but in my experience that can result in pretty memory hungry protocol upgrades.

Post by **The Robman** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 9:08 am

The protocol that I provided is the complete $005A protocol with tweeked timings, it was provided to perform a "proof of concept". It's much to large to be the official solution as there's a lot of logic in it that is not needed.

UEI has sent me the official upgrade for the 5080, which I'll post later.