JP1 Remotes Forum Index JP1 Remotes


FAQFAQ SearchSearch 7 days of topics7 Days MemberlistMemberlist UsergroupsUsergroups RegisterRegister
ProfileProfile Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages Log inLog in

Discrete possible?

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    JP1 Remotes Forum Index -> Discrete Codes
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
amadeus



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 19
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 9:26 pm    Post subject: Discrete possible? Reply with quote

1. Device: no brand AV selector and Pioneer DVR-520H
2. Type of device: AV and DVR
3. JP1 Remote model: URC-9960 and Philips Pronto
4. JP1 user? yes, used the kameleon and cable to learn some codes
5. Still have original remote? yes
6. Checked the file section? yes
7. Checked the Pronto file section (at R/C)? yes
8. Partially working setup code? yes, all codes work OK
9. Learning remote question? no

Since I wasn't able to find these anywhere, I would like to know if it is possible to somehow guess or calculate the discrete codes for the following functions (provided that the devices support such discretes):
A/V selector -> discrete on, discrete off
DVR -> the input function (it is a function that toggles the external input between L1, L2, L3, DVD and Tuner currently controlled by one toggle button)

Of the A/V selector I know that it uses protocol NEC1, device 134, subdevice 107. The power button uses OBC 30, HexCmd 87 and EFC 246.

The DVR uses the Pioneer protocol (2 commands per function), device 171 and 175, no subdevice. Unfortunately I didn't learn the "input switch" command using the kameleon but have most of the other commands learned.

I no longer have the kameleon as I use the Philips Pronto now, so here is what I got from the Pronto:

A/V Switch
learned using Pronto
900A 006D 0000 0001 866B 1EE1 # power
900A 006D 0000 0001 866B 02FD # 1
900A 006D 0000 0001 866B 06F9 # 2
900A 006D 0000 0001 866B 08F7 # 3

DVR
discrete from remotecentral
900E 0068 0000 0002 AB54 2CD3 AF50 BB44 # off
900E 0068 0000 0002 AB54 2CD3 AF50 BA45 # on
learned using Pronto
0000 0066 0000 0044 0155 00AD 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0400 0155 00AD 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0040 0016 0016 0016 0400 # input select DVD
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Robman
Site Owner


Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18311
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just FYI, NEC1 134.107 matches CBL/0770, which can be found in a few old OFA remotes.

Anyway, if the POWER button uses OBC 30, and the 1,2 and 3 buttons use OBCs 2,6 and 8, I would suggest that you test the rest of the OBCs in the range 0 thru 31 to see if you can find the discretes that you're looking for.

As for the Pioneer, the commands you posted uses the standard 2-part Pioneer signal with the following codes...

Code:
dev1 obc1 dev2 obc2
171  042  175  174 - input select DVD
171  044  175  187 - off
171  044  175  186 - on


Just FYI, if you run your Pronto files against DecodeCCF (and DecodeIR) it will give you all the code info.
_________________
Rob
www.hifi-remote.com
Please don't PM me with remote questions, post them in the forums so all the experts can help!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
amadeus



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 19
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 6:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you very much for your reply.

I have tried the codes as suggested. Either I did something wrong or the device does not support discrete on/off codes. I kept changing the second last byte leaving the rest intact - was that correct? Since there is not much risk in invoking some unwanted codes in the A/V selector, should I perhaps try all codes in the range 0-255?
I am just trying to get a better understanding of how these things work so I would like to know why 0-31 range is sufficient?

About the Pioneer. I am amazed that all that long command translates into something so simple. Is there some kind of information available that would explain how this is done? I did not find anything like this anywhere so I am guessing that this comes with experience?

What I really would like to do with this "input select" command is this. Currently I have to press is several times as each press will advace the selection in this loop: L1 -> L2 -> L3 -> DVD -> TV Tuner and back to L1 etc.
But when I run a macro to say watch a DVD I have to go directly to the DVD selection. But there is no way to tell how many times this button should be pressed. The same goes for L1, L2 etc.
What I would like to be able to do is to turn this command into 5 discrete commands if that is somehow possible.
I know that the DVR may not support this. But if it does I wonder if I could find these discretes somehow? I guess I could try changing the last bit of the command until I stumble on a working command just like with the A/V selector. But I am a bit worried that I may accidentaly stuff something up on the DVR.

What is the most common way of finding discretes for a device like this?


Last edited by amadeus on Sat Sep 17, 2005 9:29 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
pH7_jp1



Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Posts: 456
Location: Sterling Heights, MI

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have what may be the same switch. Mine is only a fiber-optic switch with 4 inputs and 2 (parallel) outputs. All the commands are the same as yours, but the 4th input is OBC 4. I believe I tried all codes and found no descretes, but it was some time ago, so I am not sure. If you do find descretes, please post them here.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
amadeus



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 19
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is the one I have (hope the link works, if not you can do a search for CAT. NO. AC1674 on that site):
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=AC1674
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
classicsat



Joined: 20 Feb 2004
Posts: 280

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does an A/V selector really need to be turned off anyway?
When I built mine, I built it with no consideration for "turning it off".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Robman
Site Owner


Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18311
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

amadeus wrote:
I kept changing the second last byte leaving the rest intact - was that correct?

When you said you are a JP1 user, even though I know you no longer have the Kameleon, I assumed that meant that you still had at least one JP1 remote that you could program using the codes that I posted.

However, I see from your reply that you need to know how to edit the Pronto hex. You should notice that there are 2 bytes that change when the command changes, the first byte is the OBC in hex format and the second byte is the complement, so you would need to edit BOTH bytes.

amadeus wrote:
Since there is not much risk in invoking some unwanted codes in the A/V selector, should I perhaps try all codes in the range 0-255? I am just trying to get a better understanding of how these things work so I would like to know why 0-31 range is sufficient?

Sure, I would agree that there's no risk, so knock yourself out. I just picked the first 32 OBCs because I consider that to be where any additional commands (if they exist, which it sounds like they don't) would be present. It's quite common for NEC signals to skip OBCs 32-63, which is why I stopped the range at 31.

amadeus wrote:
About the Pioneer. I am amazed that all that long command translates into something so simple. Is there some kind of information available that would explain how this is done? I did not find anything like this anywhere so I am guessing that this comes with experience?

There's plenty of documentation that explains the long hex string you posted as that's an example of a raw learn. The shorter strings that start with a 9000 number are using an internal database (supplied by UEI, funnily enough) that describes the format of the signal. I don't remember enough about that format to describe how to format a string from scratch, but given all the additional data that was present in your post, I knew that these were Pioneer signals, so all I had to do was translate the hex codes into decimal to give you your answers.

amadeus wrote:
What I really would like to do with this "input select" command is this. Currently I have to press is several times as each press will advace the selection in this loop: L1 -> L2 -> L3 -> DVD -> TV Tuner and back to L1 etc.
But when I run a macro to say watch a DVD I have to go directly to the DVD selection. But there is no way to tell how many times this button should be pressed. The same goes for L1, L2 etc.

This is the classic reason why people need discretes. I'm not familiar with the Pioneer DVR, the only DVRs that I'm aware of under that brand are their Tivo models, so I don't know if it supports discretes or not.

amadeus wrote:
What is the most common way of finding discretes for a device like this?

If searching the web fails, the only other option is to randomly try all the un-accounted for OBCs, as you are doing.

Just in case some other user finds this thread in the future, I have created a JP1 upgrade for the A/V selector here:
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=2192
_________________
Rob
www.hifi-remote.com
Please don't PM me with remote questions, post them in the forums so all the experts can help!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
amadeus



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 19
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

classicsat wrote:
Does an A/V selector really need to be turned off anyway?


That is true, it does not have to be turned off. I just thought that given its simplicity I would be able to learn how to discover "hidden" codes.
Unfortunately following Robman's advice I am almost certain that it does not support discrete on/off commands.

As for the Pioneer DVR.
Given that the "input select" command is 900E 0068 0000 0002 AB54 2AD5 AF50 AE51 I tried a simmilar procedure to search for disrete codes (incrementing the last part from A0 to AF) but did not find any.
So it seems that my only option is to create a power off macros for each mode that will ensure that before turning the DVR off the input will be set to L1. If all my off macros do the same, then the on macros can advance from L1 as required.

Thank you for everyone's help.

This is the list of all codes from Pioneer's website in case someone is looking for a code for Pioneer DVR-520H codes.

FUNCTION COMMAND 1 COMMAND 2
---------------------------------------------
POWER AB 2C AF BC
ON AB 2C AF BA
OFF AB 2C AF BB
ONE TOUCH COPY AB 2A AF 36
OPEN/CLOSE AB 2C AF B6
HDD AB 2A AF 64
DVD AB 2A AF 65
AUDIO AB 2C AF BE
SUBTITLE AB 2C AF 36
ANGLE AB 2C AF B5
PLAY MODE AB 2C AF 7F
INPUT SELECT AB 2A AF AE
CHANNEL- AB 2A AF 6F
CHANNEL+ AB 2A AF 6E
VCR+ AB 2A AF 66
CLEAR AB 2C AF E5
DISC NAVIGATOR AB 2C AF B4
PLAY LIST AB 2C AF B9
HOME MENU AB 2C AF B0
RETURN AB 2C AF F4
ENTER AB 2C AF EF
UP ARROW AB 2C AF F2
LEFT ARROW AB 2C AF 63
RIGHT ARROW AB 2C AF 64
DOWN ARROW AB 2C AF F3
SCAN BACK AB 25
SCAN FORWARD AB 24
PLAY AB 22
PAUSE AB 23
STOP AB 20
CM Back AB 2A AF AC
CM Skip AB 2A AF AD
CHAPTER BACK AB 27
CHAPTER FORWARD AB 26
STEP BACK AB 2C AF B8
STEP FORWARD AB 2C AF B7
RECORD START AB 28
RECORD STOP AB 21
RECORD MODE AB 2A AF 6B
TIMER RECORD AB 2A AF 69
DISC HISTORY AB 2A AF 39
NAVI MARK AB 2A AF A6
CHAPTER MARK AB 2A AF A7
EASY TIMER AB 2A AF 3A
DISPLAY AB 2C AF E3
1 AB 2C AF A1
2 AB 2C AF A2
3 AB 2C AF A3
4 AB 2C AF A4
5 AB 2C AF A5
6 AB 2C AF A6
7 AB 2C AF A7
8 AB 2C AF A8
9 AB 2C AF A9
0 AB 2C AF A0
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Robman
Site Owner


Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18311
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just converted those codes into a JP1 upgrade file...
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=2196
_________________
Rob
www.hifi-remote.com
Please don't PM me with remote questions, post them in the forums so all the experts can help!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
underquark
Expert


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 870
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 4:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If a discrete input select is not forthcoming, how about a virtual discrete? In other words, is there a command (e.g. discrete ON or discrete OFF then ON) that always jumps to one input or does it simply leave it hanging at whatever input which was previously set?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
amadeus



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 19
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 4:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

underquark wrote:
If a discrete input select is not forthcoming, how about a virtual discrete? In other words, is there a command (e.g. discrete ON or discrete OFF then ON) that always jumps to one input or does it simply leave it hanging at whatever input which was previously set?


Yes, when powered on the input always stays set to the last used selection.
It is kind of strange that there are no discrete codes for this functionality.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DaleMac



Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 27
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've found the same problem with my Pioneer Home Theatre Amp. I need to change the signal select from digital to analog when I'm changing from my DVD player to one of my VCRs. I have four possible settings. My DVD Select macro sends the signal select command twice to change from AUTO (digital for the DVD) to ANALOG (for the VCR). If the sound is coming from the wrong source or there is no sound, I just press the macro button a second time. My VCR2 Select macro does the same thing.
I'm happy just to have the function at all, considering the original remote doesn't even have this function. Thanks Rob, for the Pioneer master code list.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
amadeus



Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 19
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually I discovered a neat trick. Selecting any channel (by pressing a digit button) will set the input to TV.

Given that my input sequence is L1->L2->L3->DV->TV pressing the button positions the input at the end of this sequence.
And from there it is easy to work out how many times I need to send the command to set the input to say L3 (3x)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Capn Trips
Expert


Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 3953

PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is, in fact, a pretty standard workaround for discrete inputs on TVs/Tuners. It also often works using either the channel up or down function. I point this out since it is often the case that when using a numeric channel selection, there is a time delay before some receivers "act" on the command, awaiting a possible second digit to be sent. The CH+ or CH- formulation has the benefit of immediate response from most TV's/Tuners. (The disadvantage, of course, would be that after a week of watching various video sources, your TV may be tuned to a channel 20 or 30 or so numbers higher than you ever intended it to be.)
_________________
Beginners - Read this thread first
READ BEFORE POSTING or your post will be DELETED!


Remotes:Atlas OCAP URC 1056, Harmony One, OFA XSight Touch, AR XSight Touch
TVs: Panasonic TH-50PE700U; LG 65" Smart LED TV; RCVR: Pioneer VSX-D2016S;Onkyo TX-SR875
DVD/VCR: LG Blu-Ray player, Pioneer DV-400VK (multi-region DVD), Sony BDP-S350 (Blu-ray), Toshiba HD-A1 (HD-DVD), Panasonic AG-W1 (Multi-system VCR);
Laserdisc/CD changer: Pioneer CLD-704.
Streaming: Intel NUC PC
(But I still have to get up for my beer)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic       JP1 Remotes Forum Index -> Discrete Codes All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


 

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
Get Smart! the band's official homepage Rockabilly Central