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Func code reader for Pocket PC's IR link
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The Robman
Site Owner


Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 19506
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark Pierson wrote:
A good rule of thumb around here is that if there's no file available, and you have a learning remote, you can usually learn, decode, and build an upgrade a lot faster than sitting around waiting for a reply to see if it's been done yet.

Plus, you get the satisfaction of knowing that you have made a contribution (when you save the upgrade you created in our file section).
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www.hifi-remote.com
Please don't PM me with remote questions, post them in the forums so all the experts can help!
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drummer_geek



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 9:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would love to "give something back to the community." Being a beginner (I'm still a single digit post-er!) can be both humbling and frustrating when you don't feel understood, don't know the right questions, and don't understand the answers. I'm encouraged by the fact that others have asked for similiar functionality. I read a post here earlier where someone wanted to use an ir port on their pc and some software to read remote codes. This is reminiscent of the original request I made in this thread, so I don't feel so crazy for asking. The other thing that I wanted to know, was how to find out if a code already existed for my OEM remote, BEFORE I create one. Not that I'm trying to avoid work, but that it just doesn't make sense to do it myself if it already exists. I couldn't see how to find it with Devices4.xls without as much manual labor as it would be to hand create it in the first place. Suppose I only know I have a Runco TV (no codes), and I don't see Runco listed in the files area. Wouldn't it be nice to know that the button codes already exhist under CODE 603 in the Devices4 spreadsheet? I saw no easy way to that answer. (In my case it's JVC and Wards TVs) Regardless, reading between the lines of earlier posts, it looks like the devices4 spreadsheet only has button codes that are good for the 15-1994. I guessed from Mark's earlier post that you don't use Devices4, but look for files. I guess he means the Files / Device Codes area, but I couldn't believe that was it since it is such a small list of devices. For my Runco example, that doesn't exist in the files area, though it's defined in Devices4. I wonder if others are too. I truly appreciate the help and do not want to be a freeloader. I plan to create my device signature files (since I don't think the codes are in the spreadsheet) and upload them to this website to add to the community. That will be my pleasure. If I have this figured out right, I can do this on a per device basis (Wards TV, Sharp DVD, etc) and keep it clean for other users. I see that some posts list the devices with a specific remote, but I would think these device signature file (.txt's) can and should be viewed as independent of the remote?
Well, happy holidays everyone,
Mike
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johnsfine
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Joined: 10 Aug 2003
Posts: 4766
Location: Bedford, MA

PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

drummer_geek wrote:
Suppose I only know I have a Runco TV (no codes), and I don't see Runco listed in the files area.


There is another useful resource you might consider. That is the collection of CCF files at RemoteCentral. If it were a Runco TV, you might look at the CCF file at http://remotecentral.com/.../roger-donald_pro2.zip

You can decode CCF files withe the decodeCCF program and could find out that particular Runco TV uses NEC1 protocol, device 24, subdevice 247.

drummer_geek wrote:
Wouldn't it be nice to know that the button codes already exhist under CODE 603 in the Devices4 spreadsheet?


Yes. That would be nice. Sorry we don't have that in any appropriate form. If you post a decode (such as that NEC1:24.247) usually someone will know what, if any, built in setup code it matches. For example, I think NEC1:24.247 is TV/0247 in just a few models of remote, TV/0251 in even fewer and TV/0121 in one really obscure model.

drummer_geek wrote:
(In my case it's JVC and Wards TVs) Regardless, reading between the lines of earlier posts, it looks like the devices4 spreadsheet only has button codes that are good for the 15-1994.


I think devices.xls is more appropriate than devices4 for the direction you're trying to search. It's at least as incomplete and old as devices4. But for fairly consistent stable brands like JVC, odds are pretty good that the setup code you want will be there.
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jamesgammel
Exile Island Resident


Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 394
Location: Gillette, Wyoming

PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're pretty close with your analyis. Devices4.xls was created based on the 1994 remote. however, please remember that a whole host of other remotes may have some (probably 90%) of these setup codes as well. The C-7 and P-8's probably have the max matches, but the 8810, or 8911, or 2116 probably has about an 85-90% match as well. These later remotes had some deleted, and others added. That makes it a pretty valuable tool for almost any remote, as long as you keep in mind that there's a slight chance that one specific setup code might not happen to be in the remote you have.
The files are is probably a better source for "newer" devices. Especilly since so many of the newer devices use combination codes. Equipment available NOW id much more complex than they used to be, with more features, etc. CD players are being replaced by dvd players because in many cases a dvd player will also play cds. TV's used to have one input, now they have a pile of them. It used to be that discrete devices ruled, ie seperate preamps, amps, and tuners. Later the receiver became the "norm". Now the trend is toward HTIB's with maybe 6 devices all rolled into one. unless you want a remote that's the size of a baseball bat, seperate function keys for every little function would be monumental.
When a device upgrade is "created" with either KM or RM, for the code copied and pasted to IR it has to be remote specific. The good news is KM and RM are "smart enough" that they can convert a file written for a 1994 and convert it to one for a 8910. Thus it matters LITTLE what the device file what created for. However, when the new user "borrows" that file, he should make sure that the button assignments will work for him. now some trasposals will be pretty much automatic and logical, ie digits, volumes, channels. Mostly it will be the OTHER keys/functions which need attention. That's because those other remotes have different keys available. Look at the keys on a small 6012 and compare them to what's available on a much larger 8810. That's why you see those files 'written' for a specific remote, those happened to be the remote that the writer owned and created the file for. just remember that that's not all that important to YOU, since it's relatively easy to change the file for the remote that YOU own. As such, it's not really necessary to create files for a "generic" remote; besides, the "generic" remote doesn't even exist. Just be glad that the tools KM and RM can do the majority of the conversion for you, and the actual functions/keys you have to worry about are in the minority.
Wards Tv's were supplied by various mfr.s (Wards actually manufactures nothing, somebody makes stuff for them and puts wards brands on for them). the key to your search is to try to find out just what major outfit made the model you have.
The JVC may be a little simpler. i don't know just how many different JVC TV setup codes there are, but it's likely less than 6 or so. Most remote manuals give you a good starting point as to which setup codes to try. you can also call RS or ueic and get a "best guess" direction on which might work. Also, most remotes have a "code search" procedure which may hit paydirt. Once you find one that works, use the "blink-back" procedure to see what setup code that hit was.
In the files, many times a code created for one specific model may work another model in that same mfr. line. then there's the huge collection of CCf files that *may* even have your exact model, this is especially useful for those who either don't have a learner, or missing the oem remote for various reasons. It's pretty rare when we come up with a "Blank" with all the users, and resources we have available here. The primary tools are a learner, an oem, Ir and KM/RM, but even short one of these, in the majority of cases the "group" as a whole can "crack" almost every device.
Happy Holidays, may your remote problems in the new year be "remote".

Jim
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Mark Pierson
Expert


Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3009
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Fri Dec 26, 2003 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

drummer_geek wrote:
The other thing that I wanted to know, was how to find out if a code already existed for my OEM remote, BEFORE I create one.

The usual steps are:

Try setup codes from the manual.
Try the remotes code search function.
Look for an existing upgrade file.
Learn the OEM signals and build your own upgrade, OR post the learned signal protocol details here so one of the experts can see if it matches any exisiting codes.
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drummer_geek



Joined: 18 Dec 2003
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2003 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well you guys are consistiently helpfull. I've been offline these last few days, enjoying the holiday vacation. Hope all had a Merry! I did spend some time with IR and the JP1 For Beginners Rev 1 by T.Tyler. Wow is that document way out of date! Screens and tabs are totally different. I got the general idea, but would like better/more info on advanced topics like "key moves," "extenders," etc. I have a feeling I did them wrong (hand entered the keymoves into IR, not KM), but they work. I have been successful with setting up my remote with IR/KM for use with my JVC, Wards and Sharp devices, in that order of ease. I plan to upload my work, particularly in the case of the Sharp DV-750 DVD. It was a complete build from the ground up and it involved that wierd protocol "Kaseikyo." I noticed the JVC decoded to "JVC and JVC{2}" but that seemed to make no difference on the codes. I also found a resource on the web that lists device codes by DEVICE. Just what the doc ordered. Guess I've now graduated from beginner to intermediate.
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