JP1 Remotes

DGG · Joined: 08 Dec 2003 Posts: 143

For several months now, since joining this group, I have watched the experts answering the same questions over and over again (some of them mine) - often questions due apparently to a lack of understanding of the JP1 "system". I suspect that the experts have other things they'd just as soon be doing and that most of those who asked the questions would far rather have found the answer for themselves.

When I started JP1, I found the lack of documentation frustrating. While there's lots of "how to" documentation, including the very useful "JP-1 for Beginners", there's little that deals with the "what" and "why", or that addresses JP1 as a system (which it is).

Therefore, following completion of my URC9811 programming project, I set out to find out what makes JP1 "tick". While far from becoming an expert, along the way I did developed a couple useful special protocols, "tweaked" the 8911 extender to save a few bytes, disected a number of other ASM files and read every readme file on Yahoo! Groups JP-1.

Then, making use of my system engineering background, I tried to draw it all together. The result is "The WHAT and WHY of JP1" (which, in case this link fails, is posted in the Help area of Yahoo). The manual is aimed at "newbies" but may also contain a few "nuggets" for the more experienced. I tried not to repeat what's in "JPI for Beginners" (indeed, I intend the manual to be companion for "JP1 for Beginners") or, except where it seemed appropriate, the various readme files.

Now I need feedback. I need feedback from all types of users - experts, "newbies" and in-betweens. If you don't find the manual useful, just say so and I'll go onto other things. (My feelings aren't easily hurt.) If, on the other hand, it does seem useful, let me know and I'll spend some time "prettying" it up and extending it as you may think useful.

Please excuse any errors in this first draft. (Like I said, I'm far from an expert.) But, please do point them out to me and I'll fix them. Also, as suggested above, if there are other areas you think should be covered, let me know.

Over to you.
Don

jon_armstrong · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2004 7:23 pm Post subject:

Don,

I'l go first unless someone beats to the reply button. I too think there is a need for this sort of document and I commend you for taking on such an ambitious effort and for someone who joined forty some odd days ago an impressive grasp, indeed. I can't say I studied extensively it but I did a quick read more for scope than to provide a detailed response.

I think one of the frequently asked about topics not yet covered is: "Where do I find out how to add a missing command and/or create a device upgrade." Despite sticky posts, people with learning remotes still don't understand that with the IR.exe/DecodeIR.dll combination they have a very powerful tool to move down that path. They also seem to be reluctant to try an existing file.

I think that few novices understand that the basic IR command sets work pretty much across the board. My wife's 13" Panasonic remote can control the basic functions for a $10,000 Panasonic Plasma display.

So maybe a bit more on decoding learned commands, Pronto hex and ccf files, and RTI cml files. Also perhaps either link to Rob's explanation of IR commands and Barry's original paper on decoding Pronto hex. John Fine and I posted a bunch of links at the old Yahoo site that point to some other IR libraries that are available.
I also think that you might want to mention Protocol Builder in the Tools section, not because it is a tool for everyone but for people to know that it exists.

Finally, it is probably good to explain up-front that all JP1 physically does is read and write to the EEPROM using IR. You certainly explain this in several places and I know you understand this, but I think it helps a lot of people better understand what the tools do and how they fit. Let me know if I can help.
_________________
-Jon

DGG · Joined: 08 Dec 2003 Posts: 143

Well, Jon, it doesn't look like there was any need to rush in order to be first. I am a little disappointed at the response - but it was Thursday night.

I have tweaked and "HTMLized" the manual and, on the basis of your positive assessment, I have posted the new version in the Help section of Yahoo, where it will be more obvious, under the heading "The WHAT and WHY of JP1". (I'll also update the link in my earlier post.)

Since I'm otherwise occupied for the weekend anyway, I'll wait until Monday. If there still isn't any additional comment, I'll extend the manual along the lines you suggested, re-post in the Help section and go on to other things.

Thanks for your complimentary response,
Don

The Robman · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 12:39 pm Post subject:

I also commend you on this effort. The reason I haven't posted a response yet is because I haven't had a chance to read it yet.

Having said that, I just opened up the HTML doc and some of the links need revising.

You describe the link to my site as “hi-firemote.com” whereas in fact it's hifi-remote.com. Also the URL for these forums is http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums (you are using the old host79 address, which will break if I ever change servers).

Also, you refer to JP1 as JP-1 which would probably hinder people from finding it when using a search engine.
_________________
Rob
www.hifi-remote.com
Please don't PM me with remote questions, post them in the forums so all the experts can help!

DGG · Joined: 08 Dec 2003 Posts: 143

Thanks, Rob. I never noticed that little hypen before. A new version with your website name and URL updated has been posted.
Don

The Robman · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 1:02 pm Post subject:

DGG · Joined: 08 Dec 2003 Posts: 143

No surprise!. I copied the URLs from the website.

New version posted that's got them all.
Don

wwwoholic · Joined: 28 Nov 2003 Posts: 117 Location: Toronto, Canada

pH7_jp1 · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2004 10:53 pm Post subject:

Don,

Don't be discouraged by a perceived lack of response. Some people were reading and enjoying instead of commenting. There really isn't a lot of problems in the document and I know everyone will find something in there that helps, no matter what their experience level. It is really great that you took this on and I think a lot of beginners will get a lot of help there. Thanks

DGG · Joined: 08 Dec 2003 Posts: 143

Following limited comments, I have expanded the manual to include suggested additions and a few other topics. I have also corrected a few technical errors and, hopepfully, haven't introduced any more.

The revised version is posted at "The WHAT and WHY of JP1".

I don't anticipate expanding the manual again except, perhaps, for additional FAQs at the end.

Further comments welcome.
Don

Nils_Ekberg · Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 8:36 pm Post subject:

Nice job Don. This does a good job of bringing many pieces together. Since I am not a believer of nit-picking and the fact that I see no glaring errors I have nothing critical to say.

Just one or two little things did jump out at me. Not all (or any that I can think of) actually include the ExtInstall.exe in the extender package. The other was that based on the particular extender it may or may not have the same functions in parts I and II. They are sometimes moved from one part to the other for size of section purpose due to the 255 byte limitation of each part or the size of the lower memory available. Conceptually though you were correct.

Even though you have no plans of expanding this again I bet when you get a new energy level you will find something to add.

Again thanks...Nice job
_________________
Nils
Files Section
Diagnosis File Section

DGG · Joined: 08 Dec 2003 Posts: 143

Thanks, Nils. By not expanding, I meant increasing the scope of the document. I certainly intend to fix any errors and the presentation still needs some work. As well, I'll be happy to tweak/enhance any sections that seem anemic. And, if the FAQ section at the end is seen as promising, I'd be happy to add to that.

As for nit-picking, if it's worng, it's wrong. I certainly don't think we need a broad public discussion of the errors, but I'd welcome a private message highlighting questionable areas.

Thanks again,
Don

jon_armstrong · Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2004 9:34 am Post subject:

Don,

I just PM'd several thoughts. I think you have done an excellent job of covering a void in the existing documentation. I think many new users will appreciate your comprehensive explantion of how the pieces fit together.

Thanks again for your fine effort!
_________________
-Jon

Nils_Ekberg · Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2004 9:46 am Post subject:

DGG · Joined: 08 Dec 2003 Posts: 143

Yet another new version of "The WHAT and WHY of JP1" has been posted in the Yahoo! Help section.

This version doesn't contain a great deal of new information. However, I have extensively reorganized the first half of the document to make for a more logical information flow and to allow each section to build on its predecessors.

One of the experts has agreed to critique the manual in detail. So, hopefully the next version will be close to final.

As usual, all comments welcome. I'd particularly like comments from "newbies" to help me assess whether the manual is doing the job I intended for it.

Thanks in advance,
Don