JP1 Remotes

[unclemiltie]

Vicky

I was looking at the JP1.3 extender source (for another reason) last night and this topic got me to look at how the FAV is done.

There are two limiting factors in the JP1.3 extenders regarding the FAV processing (which is essentially a multimacro)

First, there is a limit of 15 FAV sequences since the low-nibble of the byte that determines that it is a FAV is used as the index into which macro to look for. IR codes up the FAV processing as $30 plus the index for each macro.

Second, the code fixes the length of the macro at 5 bytes. I *think* that this is controlled by an entry in the RDF, but since I really didn't do much to this area of the code, I don't remember much. however, the code in the JP1.3 extenders does have this as a variable in the code, so in theory I could make the sequences longer. One thing though, IR does pad out the FAV processing so that the length of the macro is always the maximum number by filling it in with zeros (which the extender key processing ignores)

So in theory we could make the extenders process more than 5 keys in each macro, however I'd have to build and test the logic with the constant $05 changed to see if it works. However, the other thing we could do, and I have to think about this a bit, is to allow Multi-Macro on any key (not just the small list in the remote) and essentially process EVERY macro as a multimacro. There are issues with how to keep track of the macro index for each key (I don't know if I have the room to do this) I've got to think a bit more.

-bill
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this JP1 stuff is a sickness!

[vickyg2003]

[ElizabethD]

Vicky,
I'm still not sure what you're after. And not familiar with 8811.
In case this helps, jp1 8910ext FAV structure,
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=8285
please note that you can only here have Fav button working one device inspite of the selection on the bottom left corner of the tab, and that I don't use it for channels though the procedure would be identical. But the FAV syntax is the same - 5 commands, Pause end. Each Pause is a binary zero(s) in RawData. And Fav stuff is always at the end after the macros. Edit the FAV macro in my file and you will see how jp1 works. I'm yet to see the light on Atlas or Comcast. It's all different and every attempt at use of FAV fails for me. But I haven't looked hard enough, and I gather there's no Fav support in the extender anyway. Finally, every post about 'ca we assign Fav to more than one device' either ended up with no answers or, as John Fine indicated, IR supports >1 device, the remotes do not. Maybe different with jp1.3.
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Liz
Tweeking 8910, HTPro/9811, C7-7800, 6131o, 6131n, AtlasOCAP-1056B01, RCA-RCRP05B and enjoying the ride

[vickyg2003]

[unclemiltie]

[vickyg2003]

[unclemiltie]

[vickyg2003]

[vickyg2003]

I've been experimenting with FAVs bypassing IR in favor of hand coding them and doing an unsafe upload, and I think that we really missed the boat on this one.

I went through the posts last night doing research on FAV's. It seems we've had lots of requests for multiple FAV keys. A FAV key on the JP1.x remotes carries the device number, device mode, and key so there is no need to restrict it to one device/one key. Its a compact way to store long lists for actual FAV lists like I want to do.

Another use for the FAV key is its a to create macros that pause for input. I went so far as to write a small protocol to zero out the FAV index so that I could start the FAV key sequence at the beginning .
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Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.

Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.

[mathdon]

I am currently implementing Fav/Scan for RMIR, by studying the source code of IR.exe and implementing the same behavior on RMIR. It would help, however, if I understood better what it actually does. I am OK with the action of a single entry in the Fav/Scan grid. What is puzzling me is the significance of multiple entries (i.e. multiple lines of Fav/Scan "multi-macros").

There is no ambiguity in what to do with such multiple entries in remotes with 2-byte advanced code headers (AdvCodeBindFormat = Normal), as the header does not store the index for the device button. That goes at an address given by the FavKey entry in the RDF. So in that case I know how to handle it, even though I don't understand what multiple entries actually do.

The real problem lies with remotes with 3-byte advanced code headers (AdvCodeBindFormat = Long), such as the URC 6820/8820/10820. There the device button index is stored as part of the header. The behavior of IR.exe there seems weird. If you create a New entry, the device button index of all entries, including the new one, is set to zero, regardless of the setting of the Device drop-down on the Fav/Scan tab. If you change the setting in this drop-down, the device button index of the LAST entry changes, but that of all the other entries remains zero.

I can't believe this is what is intended. I can copy this behavior in RMIR but I would prefer to do what is intended, if I knew what that was.

To add to my confusion, I downloaded the User Manual for the URC-6820. It seems to imply that there is only ONE Fav/Scan "multi-macro". So are the entries other than the last one in the Fav/Scan grid all ignored?

Can anyone help, please?
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Graham

[vickyg2003]

Hi Graham,
I've only studied this on the 10820n, and on the 10820n out of the box, that this FAV can only be a single list, with one header.

There is one register in the remote, dedicated to keeping track of the current position in the FAV key. The remote moves through the list 5 bytes at a time. Those {pause} keys that appear on the screen are just place holders when you don't need all 5 bytes while recording your macro.

As implemented by UEI, when you press the FAV key it just keeps stepping through the list of channels until the FAV key is pressed again.

UEI only allows you to record the FAV key in certain modes, and you can only have one list. This makes sense, since there is only 1 register keeping track.

On the 10820N
Once my extender has control of the remote I just hunt for a FAV header on the current key and device mode. The only reason to limit this to 1 is because of the one register. But if you don't care where the list starts processing there is no reason to keep it to one keycode or one device index. As far as I can see it is just a very compact storage method.

The limit of having one device, keycode limitation has been bothering me. I would REALLY like to be able to use this storage method for processing multiple lists on different keys, sharing that same register. Tricking IR to let me do this is difficult, since IR will not let me hand edit the RAW data, it keeps changing it back, I need to hide the RDF, open the rdf, find the bytes, change them........ Its tedious, especially when the cable company keeps moving the channels around.


I believe other extenders use a multi-macro aproach, but I haven't explored those.
_________________
Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.

Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.

[mathdon]

Many thanks, Vicky. Very interesting. It seems that as far as unextended remotes are concerned, I was right that all except the last entry are ignored. I presume the remote uses the last Fav/Scan entry in the Advanced Codes section, since that is the one that the Device drop-down affects. So the ability to put in multiple entries is presumably only there for extenders, and apparently IR.exe doesn't do what extender-writers want!

With that clarification, I'm happy with what I have done on RMIR, and pending further testing, it is finished. It will look like it does on IR.exe but the device handling works a little differently. I've kept to the IR.exe business of the Device drop-down only changing the last Fav/Scan entry, but (a) it doesn't zero out the previous ones, it leaves them unchanged, and (b) when it creates a new one it puts in the current value from the drop-down.

This enables you to put in a series of Fav/Scan entries with different devices in their headers, but you have to set the device as you want it, before you put in the next entry. Maybe that is some help to you - and will get you to try RMIR! (Wow! What is the world coming to - me advocating RMIR )

It would probably have been better to diverge from the IR.exe appearance and have a separate device editing box for each entry, but I wanted to keep the present "look and feel". I can change it in the future if there is a consensus on how it really ought to look and work.
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Graham

[gfb107]

[ElizabethD]

I'm totally out of time, so this is just (likely sloppy) bunch of comments on the latest FAV developments. If I speak nonsense, the SiteOwner can zap this post.

Vicky,
You wrote: "As implemented by UEI, when you press the FAV key it just keeps stepping through the list of channels until the FAV key is pressed again."
But that's in a unextended mode.
In extended mode it runs one mini-macro til you press Fav again, then the index advances, and it runs the second 5-step minimacro, and so on and then it cycles. Also in 8910 is not limited to channels, at least in extender. It's to any buttons/temp devices you code on the Fav list. I doubt UEI code cares if it's a number or any other button code.

Mathdon,
You wrote: "So the ability to put in multiple entries is presumably only there for extenders, and apparently IR.exe doesn't do what extender-writers want!"
as I said earlier, John Fine said in IR you can code FAV macros for multiple devices, but the remote won't accept it. At least in 8910, there's ONE byte where the FAV device is stored once forever. 8910 extender writed (David Vasques) did not assume that you can code FAV macros for more than one device. At least I never saw such a reference. Perhaps other extenders do.

Greg,
"I don't have the words to express my joy!" you finally, finally, finally, have a buddy to help. That's a first for RM in a looooong time, isn't it?

Much of my not understanding parts of this thread has to do with the definition of a header. What is it?
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Liz
Tweeking 8910, HTPro/9811, C7-7800, 6131o, 6131n, AtlasOCAP-1056B01, RCA-RCRP05B and enjoying the ride

[vickyg2003]