JP1 Remotes Forum Index JP1 Remotes


FAQFAQ SearchSearch 7 days of topics7 Days MemberlistMemberlist UsergroupsUsergroups RegisterRegister
ProfileProfile Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages Log inLog in

Newbie extender 2117 help
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    JP1 Remotes Forum Index -> JP1 - Extenders
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
bsoplinger



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 37

                    
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:13 pm    Post subject: Newbie extender 2117 help Reply with quote

I recently bought a RS 15-2117 and have been playing with it using just KM and IR.exe and all the great files at Yahoo and have my devices set up pretty well.

Then I went and read more of the forums and have seen comments about how people have created things like "I push the DVD button and everything's set" meaning that just pressing the DVD button on the remote does things like turn the DVD on (if its not) and their amp and tv and ... and set the input of the amp and/or tv to the DVD player and .... all sorts of things.

Reading more I figured out all this functionality comes from using an extender. I downloaded the 15-2116ex2 extender file, read the README and other txt files in there and am still completely in the dark.

There doesn't seem to be a general "what is an extender and what's it for?" section in the Yahoo general files area nor in the JP1 FAQs I've found.

I've gotten far enough along that I figure I need an extender but I have no idea which one (I assume the 15-2116ex2) and what I'll need to do with it once I've installed it to get things back to working.

To complicate matters, the README and other files in the 15-2116ex2 package talk about saving all the devices/protocols I've already defined and ....

Help, I'm lost, I just seem to be missing the relationship between what I've changed in my remote already using KM/IR and what the extender will do and what I need to do to get things all set up.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
gjarboni
Expert


Joined: 20 Sep 2003
Posts: 294
Location: Columbia, MD

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

An extender takes over the main processing loop of the remote. This enables the extender to do the following things:

1) Allow Keymoves or Macros on any key (Fav/Scan, light, esc, et cetera)
2) Allow Macros on the device keys (covered above but I'm calling it out)
3) Allow macros to concatenate (i.e. allows a macro to call other macros without returning) or nest (call other macros and return to the original macro).
4) Change which key is the shift key
5) Create "Home Theater" modes for each device key that are like the Home Theater mode but better (better key groupings, more key groupings, etc.)
6) (For the 8910/9910 and 15-2116/2117) Change the device description on the LCD display

What you've described involves more than just an extender. It involves discrete codes. I'm feeling long winded so I won't define discrete codes in too much detail, but:

A discrete On code turns the device on if it's on and leaves it on if it's already on
A discrete Off code turns the device off if it's off and leaves it off if it's already off

There are also discrete codes that select a certain input for a television and/or receiver and/or video switcher and/or toaster (just kidding). So what you're talking about requires an extender that puts a macro on the DVD key. This macro must contain (at a minimum)

TV:Discrete On:DVD:Discrete On:TV:Discrete Video1

(in this example I'm assuming Video1 is the appropriate input for the DVD player)

If you have a receiver you'll need to make sure that it's on and that you select the proper input there as well.

Hopefully that gives you a general idea of what an extender does and how to do what you're trying to do. Give it a whirl (save your pre-extender config in IR so you can go back easily) and come back with more questions.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address
sfhub



Joined: 12 Oct 2003
Posts: 287

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 12:23 am    Post subject: Re: Newbie extender 2117 help Reply with quote

bsoplinger wrote:
Help, I'm lost, I just seem to be missing the relationship between what I've changed in my remote already using KM/IR and what the extender will do and what I need to do to get things all set up.

This is what I suggest
1) backup your existing setup and have the confidence you can always go back to your old config
2) use ext2
3) start off simple, don't worry about migrating your devices over (skip that section of readme), just load the default ext2 in IR, and define your TV and DVD device, then upload to your remote.
4) start playing with keymoves and macros, different functions like TOADTOG, DSM, PAUSE, LDKP, CUSTOM NAME, etc. I suggest you define a Long Key Press as a quick learning tool.

Once you are comfortable with the general working of the extender, start adding more devices. As you do so, you'll start realizing what all the functions are there for.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bsoplinger



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 37

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, I'm completely baffled. I tried the complex directions of the README which tried to copy over all the things I already had in the remote and it tells me it can't copy over protocols 144 and 145 (I think those were the numbers). So then I tried the simple approach sfhub suggested but now I'm a bit lost. I need those 144 and 145 protocols to control my DVD player and Reciever and without those I really can't do too much playing with the remote. If I look at the state of my remote before I've tried adding in the extender, it shows 81 macro and 236 Upgrade space free. It seems like I don't have room enough for the extender. How do so many people manage it? Or am I just unlucky to have 2 devices each of which need a protocol?

I could remove some of the 'optional' protocols the extender adds, but it seems like I'd need the TOADTOG one to do the things I talk about in my first post and the PAUSE to do just about anything from reading other posts here about the extender and then there's the long/double key press which you talk about. Seems the only one I could remove would be the custom LCD name and that's a kinda nice feature.

Since I found all the necessary files here on the forums for my remote needs I don't have any learned commands. Could I use that memory somehow?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mark Pierson
Expert


Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3017
Location: Connecticut, USA

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bsoplinger wrote:
it tells me it can't copy over protocols 144 and 145 (I think those were the numbers)

144 = Device Combiner
145 = ReplayTV (Advanced)

The extender installs:
MISC/1103, protocol 1FC = Device specific Macro
MISC/1104, protocol 1FB = Pause
MISC/1106, protocol 1F9 = Long/Double Key Press
MISC/1107, protocol 1F8 = Custom Mode Name
MISC/1800, protocol 181 = ToadTog

So I don't see where the conflict is.


Quote:
Since I found all the necessary files here on the forums for my remote needs I don't have any learned commands. Could I use that memory somehow?

The extender is already using the former learned space.

You can try deleting your protocol upgrades (you did save the KM files, right?) before creating the extender file, and then add them back to the newly created extender image before uploading to the remote.
_________________
Mark
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
bsoplinger



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 37

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark Pierson wrote:
So I don't see where the conflict is.


There isn't any room, it says that the Upgrade space is only 95 bytes and each of those 2 extenders are 97 bytes big so I can't put either let alone both into the remote. That's where the conflict is.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Nils_Ekberg
Expert


Joined: 02 Aug 2003
Posts: 1689
Location: Near Albany, NY

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bsoplinger wrote:
Mark Pierson wrote:
So I don't see where the conflict is.


There isn't any room, it says that the Upgrade space is only 95 bytes and each of those 2 extenders are 97 bytes big so I can't put either let alone both into the remote. That's where the conflict is.
How many device upgrades and how many protocols do you have installed in the original IR file? Also, how much does the original IR show available for upgrades. I can see if you have 8 device upgrades and the 2 special protocols loaded you may be tight.
_________________
Nils
Files Section
Diagnosis File Section
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
bsoplinger



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 37

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have 7 devices defined, 6 of those have upgrades, 1 I use out of the box but I need to learn 2 commands from it, I still haven't figured out how to convert the learned info into keymoves or macros (since I really don't need an upgrade for my cheap tv, just 2 buttons).

I have 2 Sony VCRs, Replay, Atlanta 8000 cable box, Onkyo reciever, Cheap Zenith TV (which I can live with the base 17 command set if I have the 2 learned commands), Cyberhome DVD player, Sony MD player, total of 8 devices and I could use a few more: LD Player, 2nd Replay, Beta VCR, SVHS VCR among others. I think I need the all in one 12 Wink

The Onkyo, Sony VCR mode 3, Cyberhome and Replay have to have the device upgrades since the basic device isn't in the remote and the Onkyo and Replay have the 2 large protocols. I could loose the other Sony VCR upgrade and the Zenith TV upgrade, but that's about it.

If I pare things down as much as I can, I'm still about 100 bytes short I think. Can I steal those 100 from the macro section?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mark Pierson
Expert


Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3017
Location: Connecticut, USA

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bsoplinger wrote:
If I pare things down as much as I can, I'm still about 100 bytes short I think. Can I steal those 100 from the macro section?

So you're saying you can't install the extender because there's no room left? If that's the case, why don't you delete all those upgrades and protocol code, create an extender file using ExtInstall, and then put all the upgrades and protocol code back into the new file?
_________________
Mark
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
bsoplinger



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 37

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because as I put them back in I use up the memory and end up with needing to either add a device and its protocol or if I do all the devices then there's no room at all for the 2 protocols I need. Basically, the ExtInstall seems to have done things right when it says there isn't room for the 2 protocols after adding all the devices I have. Doing it manually gets me to exactly the same place.

I do have plenty of macro/keymove room though, so I'll ask again, is there some way I can get some of that?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mark Pierson
Expert


Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3017
Location: Connecticut, USA

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bsoplinger wrote:
Because as I put them back in I use up the memory...

I do have plenty of macro/keymove room though, so I'll ask again, is there some way I can get some of that?

Ok, my bad (sometimes you can't see the forest through the trees). Embarassed For some reason I thought the extender increased the Upgrade space as well as the Key Move/Macro space. I just checked and see that's not the case. Doh!

Evidently, you've got a lot shoe-horned into the remote already, and the additional extender Upgrades and Protocols push you over the edge.

I'm not sure if the Key Move and Upgrade areas can be massaged easily to accomplish what you need, though I do think it's possible. One of the extender experts will need to give a definitive answer.
_________________
Mark
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Mark Pierson
Expert


Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3017
Location: Connecticut, USA

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe you can upload your un-extended IR configuration to the Diagnosis area and someone can look at it to see if there's anything you can do to reduce some of what you have.
_________________
Mark
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
vasqued2
Expert


Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 67

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like you have 2 options.

The first would be to delete some of the Special Protocols and corresponding device upgrades included w/ the 2116_ex2.txt extender file that you won't need. Just don't delete the TV 1800 device upgrade or the $0180 protocol, these are needed to activate the extender. Then add in your own upgrades. If you get rid of ToadTog and/or the LDKP if should free up enough space.

The second would be to use Keymoves instead of a device upgrade (Your "cheap TV") would be one example of this. Once you know the built in Setup Code, just type in the EFC from the Learned Signals tab into the Keymove dialogue. You can do this with whatever device upgrades have a built in setup code.

I posted a brief explanation a couple days ago in another thread on how to adjust a couple variables and then recompile the extender, adjust the rdf, etc. But you should be pretty familiar w/ the JP1 before trying it.

One final option would be to use v1 of the extender, it has more memory available for upgrades.

David
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bsoplinger



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 37

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vasqued2 wrote:
Sounds like you have 2 options...
The second would be to use Keymoves instead of a device upgrade (Your "cheap TV") would be one example of this. Once you know the built in Setup Code, just type in the EFC from the Learned Signals tab into the Keymove dialogue. You can do this with whatever device upgrades have a built in setup code.
David


Hmm, this part sounds promising, but I'm not quite sure what you're telling me. For example, with the Replaytv device upgrade I get access to things like the guide menu and replay menu directly that don't seem to be part of the builtin device. If I were to go back to the 'original' remote setup, without the extender but with learned memory, I would learn these commands, upload to IR, look at the Learned Signals tab and ....?

I understand up to that point, the type in the EFC into the keymover dialog part has me lost.

Sorry if I'm being too obtuse and not understanding this, unfortunately its all new to me.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sfhub



Joined: 12 Oct 2003
Posts: 287

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2004 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bsoplinger wrote:
Hmm, this part sounds promising, but I'm not quite sure what you're telling me. For example, with the Replaytv device upgrade I get access to things like the guide menu and replay menu directly that don't seem to be part of the builtin device.

You may be able to get by using the Panasonic Protocol for ReplayTV,
which I believe is builtin to the remotes. You could potentially save space
by not needing upload ReplayTV hacked protocol.

http://hifi-remote.com/cgi-bin2/ueic.cgi?PVR_0616
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic       JP1 Remotes Forum Index -> JP1 - Extenders All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


 

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
Top 7 Advantages of Playing Online Slots The Evolution of Remote Control