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Inkel (Sherwood) AD20

 
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wearezogg



Joined: 26 Jun 2021
Posts: 6

                    
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:15 pm    Post subject: Inkel (Sherwood) AD20 Reply with quote

Subject: Inkel (Sherwood) AD20


1. Device: Inkel AD20 (remote has its own model name RD50)
2. Type of device: Amplifier
3. Year: 1980s? Antiquated.
4. JP1/UEI Remote model: Atlas 1056b03
5. Do you have a JP1 cable? Yes
6. Still have original remote? No
7. Checked the file section? Yes
8. Checked Pronto file section (at R/C)? Yes
9. Partially working setup code? No
10. Learning remote question? n/a
11. Have you tried the JP1 Lookup Tool? Yes..
12. If you have a OARUSB04G (or similar) remote, have you tried simpleset.com? n/a

Manual:
https://elektrotanya.com/inkel_sherwood_td10_ad20_cd30_pd40_rd50_sm.pdf/download.html
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 21183
Location: Chicago, IL

                    
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you tried any of the other Sherwood upgrades that we have, just in case your unit uses the same remote codes? The Sherwood 6030R uses NEC2 131.68, and the others use NEC1 or NEC2 with 131.69, so I would try the 6030R upgrade first, then if that doesn't work, try any of the others, no need to try them all. And try the power and volume buttons first, as those are most likely to be common between models.

http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=category&cat_id=9&sort_method=file_name&sort_order=ASC&start=467
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Rob
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wearezogg



Joined: 26 Jun 2021
Posts: 6

                    
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tried all the remote codes that came up for the "inkel" brand which included the NEC2 131.68 and NEC1 131.69 codes. (created an upgrade with just the power button) I'll try the 6030R upgrade just in case. The thing is so old I know it's a long shot. I does make a good IR detector though as every time an IR signal is sent anywhere in the room it flashes a bright red LED in sync with it.
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does the unit have a push/pull POWER button? If so, it might be better to test using the volume buttons from the various upgrades, rather than the POWER button.
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wearezogg



Joined: 26 Jun 2021
Posts: 6

                    
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No push/pull. The manual states that the remote (RD50) can control the amplifiers:
Power on/off
Phono/tuner/tape selector
and Volume Up/Down

I'll give the volume controls a try. The 6030R upgrade was a no go.

I also just found the following line from the manual:

"Remote Control Technics 15 Bites Pulsecode Modulated Infrared beam"
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3FG
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Joined: 19 May 2009
Posts: 3365

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jun 29, 2021 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Page 28 of the manual is a block diagram that shows a TA9134 as the remote receiver IC. Page 30 lists IC102 as TC9134, and the circuit diagram on page 33 shows the various connections to the IC. Page 38 gives the function codes.

Here's two PDF files that provide info about the TC9134. One is in Japanese.
http://hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=26350
http://hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=26351
TC9132 datasheet

Basically, this IR protocol is very simple, but the timing details are not clear. Here is my guess of the IRP for the 22 "single shot" signals:
Code:

{38Khz,2250}<1|-1>(1,C:3,0,1, F:5,1,9,  1,C:3,0,1, F:5,1,27)+)

My Japanese wife tells me that the text says the 16 bit signal is sent twice, and also 8 bits of zeros should be sent before the signal. I take that to mean a leadout. The TC9132 data sheet tells that same story in a figure.

The circuit diagram shows C=11 (all three bits are 1) although I can't tell if the IR signal is inverted. If it is inverted then C=0.

I can make an executor to send this signal for the 1056B03, but I don't have time tonight. Also, getting this to work may take a fair amount of experimentation, so I prefer not to work on an executor unless the OP is sure he wants to invest the time.
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wearezogg



Joined: 26 Jun 2021
Posts: 6

                    
PostPosted: Tue Jun 29, 2021 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks 3FG.
I have a esp8266 set up to transmit and receive IR. ( https://github.com/crankyoldgit/IRremoteESP8266 )
It can send and capture raw signals. With the IRP you have given I should be able to work out what to transmit. Once I have signals that work I can either use the esp8266 to translate received signals into something the unit can understand and/or make an executor for the 1056B03 myself.(which I would like to try) Thanks a lot for the help.
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wearezogg



Joined: 26 Jun 2021
Posts: 6

                    
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Update:
With the info supplied by 3FG I have been able to create raw IR codes to control the Inkel AD20 amplifier. The following information should work for any remote based on the TC9132P chip.

Timing of each bit is determined by the frequency of the crystal used:

T=timing
XF= crystal frequency

T= 1024/XF

In the case of the Inkel AD20 this is 455khz so this gives 2250us.

Carrier frequency is given by

CF = XF/12

For the Inkel AD20 case this gives 37.916khz ~ 38khz

The code itself is 16 bits transmitted twice:

C1-C3 = device bits (0 0 0 not used)
A-E = data bits

1 C1 C2 C3 0 1 A B C D E 1 0 0 0 0

Which gives a protocol with only 7 devices and 32 codes

In the case of the Inkel AD20 all the device bits on the remote are connected to HI (device = 7 ) and the code for power on/off is 00111
so:

1 111 01 00111 10000
sent twice:
1111010011110000 1111010011110000

which gives raw timings of:
+9000 -2250 +2250 -4500 +9000 -9000 +9000 -2250 +2250 -4500 +9000 -9000.

which I have tested and will switch on the amp. Other data codes for the Inkel AD20:

LSB left to right
Power 00111 (28)
Tape select 01111 (30)
Phono select 11001 (19)
Tuner select 01001 (18)
Vol + 11101 (23)
Vol - 01101 (22)

Continuous transmit keys such as Vol +/- should delay 32 bits (32 x 2250us) between re-transmit.
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 21183
Location: Chicago, IL

                    
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I think we can summarize the signal like this:

Code:
li dev    -obc- leadout
1  111 01 00111 10000


Freq: 38 kHz
1: +2250 -0
0: +0 -2250
Leadin: +2250 -0
Leadout: +2250 -9000

5-bit device code (where the last 2 bits are fixed)
5-bit command code

Edit: I just noticed that some buttons do repeat, and those need a -81,000 OFF time
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wearezogg



Joined: 26 Jun 2021
Posts: 6

                    
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2021 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I stumbled across and Atlas 5 Day URC-1055 JP1.3 3033 at the local thrift shop for $4 and since it is based on the S3C80 chip it was pretty easy to create my own protocol that works with the Inkel AD20 after which I subsequently noticed that "The Robman" had already done this. (D'oh) Both the protocol I created and the one Rob created work with the unit (tested) but there is one thing to note: the protocol I created does not use repeating buttons. After direct experimentation I noted that the volume controls for the unit directly control servo motors that move the volume control. One button push moves the volume quite a bit (~10% or so) and there is no "stop" at either end so the servo motors keep running if the button is pressed. It's very easy to accidentally smash the volume control into either end of the limits with the "repeat" buttons implement and since the equipment is so old I worry about damage to the servo motors etc. Thanks for the help on this 3FG, The Robman.

TC9132P.prot file:

[TC9132P]
PID=01 FF
DevParms=Device 1:5=0
DeviceTranslator=Translator(lsb,0,5)
CmdParms=OBC:5
CmdTranslator=Translator(lsb,0,5)
DefaultCmd=00
CmdIndex=0
FixedData=00
Code.S3C80=3D 97 11 8B 14 85 34 05 05 04 51 00 00 00 00 04 51 11 94 04 51 00 00 FF 02 8D 01 33

Valid device IDs go from 17 to 23. Inkel AD20 (RD50 remote) Device ID is 23.

Command numbers (OBC) for Inkel AD20 (RD50 remote)

#28 power
#23 vol up
#22 vol down
#18 tuner
#19 phono
#30 tape

#00 FM
#01 AM
#03 1
#04 2
#05 3
#06 4
#07 5
#08 6
#09 7
#10 T/T up/down
#11 T/T Reject
#12 REW
#13 STOP
#14 FF
#15 REC
#16 PLAY
#17 PAUSE

RD50L remotes:

#01 MW
#02 LW
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 21183
Location: Chicago, IL

                    
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2021 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I created that protocol but didn't have time to test it, so I loaded the file with a view to testing it later, so I'm glad you got it to work. As the button codes are only 5-bits, and you get 8-bits in a byte whether you need them or not, I used the outermost unused bit as a repeat control, so if it's set, the button will repeat while the button is held. What did you find that works for your unit?

Now that the cat is out of the bag, here's a link to the file:

http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=26353
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