Empty spots not respected on soft key pages

kkl · Post by **kkl** » Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:38 pm

I've noticed on my XSight Touch that empty spaces are not respected on soft key pages. Each page has room for six entries. However, if I assign functions to Soft1 and Soft2, then Soft7, all of those functions will appear on the same page. Blank spaces aren't left for Soft3-6, so Soft7 appears on the first page. Is there a recommended method to work around this?

I apologize if this has been asked and answered, but I didn't come up with anything trying to search for it.

mdavej · Post by **mdavej** » Sun Mar 29, 2020 5:34 pm

Yes, this is a known issue. It's just how Xsight works. There is no workaround other than putting bogus functions where you want blanks. I've never tried using just a space, which would look blank. But you could make a function with a code you know doesn't do anything and give it a name like space (if that works) or underscore or something like that and assign it to all buttons you want to be blank.

I've never tried the above, so let us know how it works out.

kkl · Post by **kkl** » Sun Mar 29, 2020 6:36 pm

Thanks very much for the answer mdavej. If I find a good work around, I'll post back.

120240VAC60HZ · Post by **120240VAC60HZ** » Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:57 pm

You can try an empty space acsii code (hold the "ALT" key and type 255 on the number pad). that is a blank character but is counted as something

chileboy · Post by **chileboy** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:10 pm

I wanted to do this (Xsight Color) on the device screen for my Anthem AVM 50. I found I could in fact name a function with simply a space and assign it to a softkey.

After that it got a bit tricky. I first gave it a hex of 00, but that triggered Mute on my Anthem (even though the "real" mute function has a different hex, etc.)

I went back and changed the EFC/EFC5 to 0 (zero) and that did it, the button doesn't seem to do anything now.

Note that after setting the EFC to 0, upon saving it sets the all fields to non-zero values (even the EFC got set to 2). But that didn't seem to matter in my case. Also, if you create the function <space> and then change the hex/EFC, it won't show up on the layout any longer (although it remains assigned). But renaming it to "x" or something, save, renaming back to <space> fixes it.

Post by **The Robman** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:23 pm

Regarding hex 00 or EFC 0, given that you are creating an actual function for the upgrade, it's not so important that you set something to zero, which as you've found might be a real code, it's more just a case of finding an OBC that doesn't do anything and using that. If you sort your upgrade by OBC, you will often notice gaps, it's often worth trying these gap OBCs to see if they do anything as they might be secret discrete codes or similar. If you find they do something, write it down and add it to the upgrade, if you find they don't do anything, feel free to use these for your SPACE functions.

mdavej · Post by **mdavej** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:32 pm

Thanks for the confirmation about using space.

Realize the EFC 0 doesn't mean "do nothing". It's a perfectly valid value that often has a real function. You could have taken a wild guess (from 0-255) and tested it to see if it really had no effect.

The more meaningful number is the OBC. If you sort by OBC, you'll often see a logic pattern and fixed range of values. The EFC is a scrambled (encrypted) version of the OBC. So next time you're searching for codes that do nothing or even something new, sort by OBC and pick a new value inside or outside its range.

chileboy · Post by **chileboy** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:49 pm

Yeah, I freely admit I was shooting in the dark a bit and realized I may have gotten lucky.

Plus I was thinking maybe some random code might trigger something on a different device that happened to be using the same protocol.

Looking at what you said, the OBC values seemed to range between 1 and 47. I changed the OBC value to a random number above 48, but it still triggered a random input change. I changed it to one that I knew what it did (0 {zero}) on the keypad, but has no effect. I figured that was safer than just using something unknown that might trigger something crazy like a factory reset.

Post by **The Robman** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 8:38 pm

So, triggering a random input change is exactly what we're looking for when we go searching for secret discrete codes. What I do when I program new gear into my remote is, I copy/paste all the known functions and their OBCs into a spreadsheet, then I create a list of all the gap OBCs, either in the usual 1-47 range or above, and load them into some dummy upgrades, then I load those dummy upgrades into my remote and test all the buttons. If any of them do anything, I make a note of which button in which device mode it was so I can check my spreadsheet to see what OBC that was, and voila! I just discovered a new function that wasn't on the OEM remote.

chileboy · Post by **chileboy** » Sat Aug 29, 2020 4:03 pm

The Robman wrote:So, triggering a random input change is exactly what we're looking for when we go searching for secret discrete codes. What I do when I program new gear into my remote is, I copy/paste all the known functions and their OBCs into a spreadsheet, then I create a list of all the gap OBCs, either in the usual 1-47 range or above, and load them into some dummy upgrades, then I load those dummy upgrades into my remote and test all the buttons. If any of them do anything, I make a note of which button in which device mode it was so I can check my spreadsheet to see what OBC that was, and voila! I just discovered a new function that wasn't on the OEM remote.

That is a great idea - but couldn't that be a bit risky? Just asking.

My Anthem has some pretty extensive user settings that I've made heavy use of. Not long ago somehow it got reset to factory defaults, and it took me forever to reprogram it. Yes, you can back them up but of course I hadn't done it for a very long time. I've been paranoid about doing it again ever since (but also obsessive about backing them up).

Hence my earlier example about an unintended consequence!

Post by **The Robman** » Sat Aug 29, 2020 4:42 pm

It's not without risk, but I was say that the risk is minimal, but of course, that's your decision. We used to find that some TV sets had special codes that would reset the whole EEPROM and that wasn't good, but I haven't heard of anyone trashing their gear by code searching in a good many years. I certainly have no qualms about trying it with my stuff.

chileboy · Post by **chileboy** » Sat Aug 29, 2020 5:09 pm

Yeah, I was only half-serious actually

Believe me, I've bricked a more than one device doing something "unsupported".

chileboy · Post by **chileboy** » Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:01 pm

The Robman wrote:It's not without risk, but I was say that the risk is minimal, but of course, that's your decision. We used to find that some TV sets had special codes that would reset the whole EEPROM and that wasn't good, but I haven't heard of anyone trashing their gear by code searching in a good many years. I certainly have no qualms about trying it with my stuff.

I was reading through the "Hall of Shame" last night and found a particular episode from years ago that triggered some...forum craziness. I think it was a LD player.

Quite a thread.

Post by **The Robman** » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:33 pm

chileboy wrote:
The Robman wrote:It's not without risk, but I was say that the risk is minimal, but of course, that's your decision. We used to find that some TV sets had special codes that would reset the whole EEPROM and that wasn't good, but I haven't heard of anyone trashing their gear by code searching in a good many years. I certainly have no qualms about trying it with my stuff.
I was reading through the "Hall of Shame" last night and found a particular episode from years ago that triggered some...forum craziness. I think it was a LD player.

Quite a thread.

Ah, you mean this one where James Gammel went off on one of his rants. As you can probably tell, that wasn't his first rant, but it was his last. It's been over 16 years since we kicked him out but we still remember that idiot.

chileboy · Post by **chileboy** » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:53 pm

The Robman wrote:Ah, you mean this one where James Gammel went off on one of his rants. As you can probably tell, that wasn't his first rant, but it was his last. It's been over 16 years since we kicked him out but we still remember that idiot.

That's the one.