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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:06 am    Post subject: rdf Reply with quote

I know it is complicated but I want to know how to make an RDF
Specifically the Button Maps and the digit maps. I have the RDF4Spec_r004 and
RDF4Spec_Addendum_rev4.
It also says
Creating these entries will typically require the help of a JP1 expert, and is beyond the scope of this document. If it is too difficult could someone tell me a a little about how the maps are made.
It may help me and others to become developers for future remotes
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18098
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why do you ask, do you have a new remote that is not supported?

Typically, if someone wants to really get into JP1 development, they've made more than 5 posts in 3 years. Based on your limited number of posts, we would have to assume that you're a complete beginner and we would therefore have to explain to you many of the basic fundamentals before we could explain some of the more advanced stuff that goes into creating an RDF.

The RDF spec explains as much as we can explain, without including a "JP1 basics" in the doc, as the target audience is folks who already know JP1 pretty well.

Maybe, if you state what your real goals are, we can better help.
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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 11:55 am    Post subject: RDF Reply with quote

I am trying to get a remote to work because i have 5 of them from a recycling place
It is a Manawa Telecom Video and looks like the Millennium 4 with the signature of 3033 It uses the S3F80 processor Battery Compartment sticker is urc-4mxxxbj10-r
and I Can download and upload using 30333033 (Atlas 5 Day URC-1055_11055 JP1.3 3033
so it is the wrong RDF but it will upload and work but of course buttons are wrong
I have modified both 30333033 (Atlas 5 Day URC-1055_11055 JP1.3 3033 and
MIL0MIL0 (Millennium 4-B00). RDF'S with some succes I do not care if I ruin a remote since I have 5 of them. I did not want to bother the forum to make a RDF if not many people have this remote I repair lcd tvs from the recycling company and may include these remotes with the tv as i also donate some of the tvs to different organizations and it would be nice if they had a remote to go with it
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mdavej
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Joined: 08 Oct 2003
Posts: 3572

PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's the simplest way for a beginner to work out the button codes:
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=109335#109335
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18098
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UEI often uses remotes like the Mil4 for different OEM companies, with different silk screening of button names, etc and sometimes they even use an existing chip in a completely different remote, so if your remote has the 3033 signature, I would expect that everything in the 3033 RDF is correct, except for the button names, and even those should be mostly correct, with just some of the more unusual buttons being different (and maybe the device buttons).

So, what I would do is figure out what real buttons correspond to the button names in the RDF. Using macros is the easiest way to do that (ie, if you create a macro with buttons A, B and C, and when you download using RMIR you see X, Y and Z, that means you can edit X, Y and Z in the RDF to be A, B and C.
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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:46 pm    Post subject: RDF Reply with quote

I will try that idea of creating a macro with buttons A, B and C my time is limited though
so I may not get around to it for a month or so, that is also why I do not post much on this
forum, But I greatly appreciate the hard work that has gone into RMIR
It is a great deal of excellent computer programing skills, and knowledge
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2017 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No rush from our side! Laughing
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unclemiltie
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Joined: 21 Jan 2004
Posts: 1719
Location: San Ramon, CA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2017 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Every time I've seen a remote in the JP1.3 family with the same signature that means it's essentially the same remote with a different label printed under the buttons. (i.e. all of the buttons are in the same exact place for all of the remotes)

So in essence, you can look at the Atlas OCAP 3033 remote (or photos) and RDF, look at your remote and edit the Atlas OCAP 3033 ref to match the button names you want.

The set up code tables, button maps, and that kind of stuff take a lot of investigation by the experts. much of it through trial and error and standing on the shoulder of the experts that came before us. (i.e. we know the previous digit tables so when we find a new one we add it to the list)

To do what you want to accomplish won't require that kind of investment in time and effort.
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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 6:04 am    Post subject: RDF Reply with quote

Thanks for the responses
I am sure I will get it working someday when I have time
I like the challenge that is why I repair LCD TV's
I can tell you today's tvs are designed to fail
My last one was just 40 bad solder joints that just needed resoldering
I enjoy repairing tv's more than I do watching tv that is why I donate them
I have spare parts so it does not cost me anything and I learn something new each day
I work on a different TV.
Remote controls fascinate me.I once repaired a stereo That the OEM remote did not work on Physically the remote looked fine but it turned out the crystal was off frequency I replaced the crystal and it worked perfectly. Just an idea in case anyone should run into such problems
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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2017 7:38 pm    Post subject: RDF final Reply with quote

Ok so here is what I finally ended up with
I started with the 30333033 (Atlas OCAP URC-1056 JP1.3 (Black)_(Silver)) RDF
and it worked but the arrow keys were tied to cable i could not use them on tv
When i added a tv upgrade there was alot of keymoves and the keys still did not work right
I then looked at other RDF'S and copy and pasted a line from the UMIAUMI0 (Millenium Interactive URC-41xxxB00) Button maps into the (Atlas OCAP URC-1056 JP1.3 (Black)_(Silver)) RDF and now the keys work right on tv.
Neither RDF was fully correct for me it took a combination of 2 of them
Some of the button map # are duplicate and I need to refine it but the remote is working good now. Only problem that I have that i have not fully investigated is that vpt is not working correctly. But at least everything else is is fine
So i now have a working remote thanks to this forum
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unclemiltie
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Joined: 21 Jan 2004
Posts: 1719
Location: San Ramon, CA

PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2017 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's definitely odd

The button maps are hard coded into the firmware of the remote so the button map table has to match the button maps that are in the remote. As I've said before I've not yet seen a JP1.3 remote that doesn't have the same configuration information like button maps, button lists, etc. when the signature is the same. This one could be the exception to the rule though.
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vickyg2003
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Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 6946
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:32 am    Post subject: Re: RDF final Reply with quote

HamburgerHelper1 wrote:
Ok so here is what I finally ended up with
I started with the 30333033 (Atlas OCAP URC-1056 JP1.3 (Black)_(Silver)) RDF
and it worked but the arrow keys were tied to cable i could not use them on tv

It seems to me that you jumped to the conclusion that the experts here messed up and all the people that use this popular remote family did not catch the problem. The guys that do the button map and digit maps know their stuff and are very precise. Of course they can make mistakes, but a mistake on this magnitude would certainly have been caught. The 3033 series is one of the more popular series around.

The button maps and digit maps were not the clue. They may have "fixed" the problem just by forcing the RMIR to set up keymoves, where the buttons could have been included in the upgrade.

Are you familiar with the CBL Channel Control Lock that is on the General Tab. When CBL Channel lock is on, the channel changing keys and the menu arrows and OK will be locked in cable mode. The key was to turn that off.

Instead you messed around with the digit maps which are going to screw up the numbers 0-9 in any upgrades, and you changed the button maps which tell RMIR which flags to set to get the functions assigned to the right buttons which buttons need to made into keymoves instead of included in the upgrade. This probably led you to the conclusion that the buttons needed to be renamed, which should not have been true if you had left the RDF alone.
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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:48 am    Post subject: RDF Reply with quote

Yes it is weird neither rdf worked fully right.
I started adding numbers into the button map manually and saw them show up in rmir when set to create a tv upgrade certain buttons the started working
so then I got the idea of copy and paste some of the 2 rdf's together to see what would happen and it worked

From what I can tell since I got the remotes from a local recycling center.
is that the remote came with ABD set top box & Millennium 4 remote
the PDF manuals mention local cities so I am thinking that they must have done some customization to the remote.
It was an interesting learning process Challenging and yet fun at the same time
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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CBL Channel lock was not the problem I tried it on and off
From what the rdf was doing by leaving it alone was that I could not use menu or arrow
keys to adjust tv settings it would work if I put the tv upgrade on the cable button but i wanted it on the tv button So yes i did a backwards hack I know the experts have the rdf correct but the menu and arrow keys would not work on tv and CBL Channel lock did not fix it,
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HamburgerHelper1



Joined: 22 Feb 2014
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok i did everything over UMIAUMI0 (Millenium Interactive URC-41xxxB00)
rdf gives fixed data wrong.
But using 30333033 (Atlas OCAP URC-1056 JP1.3 (Black)_(Silver)) RDF
with URC-41xxx.map works without me modifying button maps
The only difference is that I have phantom buttons for menu, select,source, enter, and dash
The map does not show circles around menu, ok, or enter but it does work
with leaving button maps alone
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