RadioShack 15-13x Phantom Names

Post by **vickyg2003** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:52 am

If I'm using the wrong RDF's please just set me straight. I've got so many versions of the RDF's that I'm never quite sure which is current.

I am curious as to why the Phantom names in this series of remotes have such wierd names. If these remotes are basically the same remotes, then wouldn't calling Phantom3, PhantomPIP make more sense? If I'm not mistaken, if you used phantom3 in a macro, or keymove, it would give you a PIP function wouldn't it? And while the PIP keys might be a bad example, the discrete inputs might be quite different.

Or am I totally misunderstanding the significance ofthe signature?

phantomMS 01
phantomMS 01
MS 01

phantom3 29
PIP 29
PIP 29

phantom4 2A
Swap 2A
Swap 2A

phantom5 2B
Move 2B
Move 2B

phantom6 2C
Freeze 2C
Freeze 2C

phantom7 2D
phantom3 2D
Mode 2D

phantom8 2E
Format 2E
Aspect 2E

phantom9 2F
phantom4 2F
HDMI_In 2F

phantom10 30
DVR

30
DVR
- 30
  
  phantom11 36
  phantom5 36
  COMP_In 36
  
  phantom12 38
  phantom6 38
  CC 38
  
  phantom13 3E
  Page+ 3E
  phantom3 3E
  
  phantom14 3F
  Page- 3F
  phantom4 3F
  
  phantom15 40
  ViewTV 40
  phantom5 40
  
  phantom16 49
  phantom7 49
  TV_In 49
  
  phantom18 71
  Dash 71
  Dash 71

mdavej · Post by **mdavej** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 9:54 am

THIS is the spreadsheet I use to build the RDF's. It may not be the lastest though, since I keep my master on a different computer that I can access right now. Honestly, it never occurred to me to name them the way you proposed. I wish you had brought this up a long time ago.

Another reason is that I did the 135 RDF first and didn't know what the other functions were on other remotes. I also never thought of associating a phantom with a fixed functions. I think the idea of a phantom with a fixed function is meaningless anyway, so I just gave them numbers and treated the different models independently. The only exception is phantomMS (MySystem), which really does function as Home Theater mode in all the 13x remotes.

Are you saying that, for example, phantom12 truly executes a CC function on the 133? I guess it makes sense that it would. One oddball is phantom10 on the 133. It functions as the light button, not DVR like it does on the others.

Do you think it would confuse users of just one remote to see phantoms for non-existent functions? Phantoms seem to blow people's minds to begin with. Phantoms with an actual built-in function may actually disrupt the space-time continuum, ending all life as we know it

In any case, the 13x is apparently now obsolete, and I've got so many users out there, I'll probably leave well enough alone.

BTW, if anyone wants to buy one cheap, I've got a closet full. Just PM me.

Post by **vickyg2003** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:22 am

mdavej wrote:Are you saying that, for example, phantom12 truly executes a CC function on the 133? I guess it makes sense that it would. One oddball is phantom10 on the 133. It functions as the light button, not DVR like it does on the others.

I THINK so. But everytime I assume ANYTHING about these remotes, I'm wrong. It would seem to me that if that if phantom12 was received, and there was no keymove to it, it would execute the underlying setup function assigned to that via the keympaps.

mdavej wrote:Do you think it would confuse users of just one remote to see phantoms for non-existent functions? Phantoms seem to blow people's minds to begin with. Phantoms with an actual built-in function may actually disrupt the space-time continuum, ending all life as we know it

In any case, the 13x is apparently now obsolete, and I've got so many users out there, I'll probably leave well enough alone.

BTW, if anyone wants to buy one cheap, I've got a closet full. Just PM me.

I think that phantoms are confusing yes, but I also think if someone is using a remote and needs the HDMI discrete, it might be helpful to know that phantomHDMI might hold the answer, so they don't have to hunt through all the upgrades hoping to find a discrete. But that would all depend on if my assumption is right.

mdavej · Post by **mdavej** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:01 am

I suspect they work as you say. Can you confirm a couple, just to be certain? The next question is which phantoms do we dedicate to DiscreteOn/Off? I tried to pick ones that were present in every device so they wouldn't be keymoves, and I really like the idea of keeping them. Then both KM and the extenders would have to be changed to match. I've still got some old RDF's floating around out there because I shuffled some buttons around before and broke KM.

I don't own any 135's anymore so I couldn't confirm what works on a real 135 key would also work on a 133 or 134 phantom.

Does anyone else have an opinion on this?

Post by **ElizabethD** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:30 pm

I prefer numbered Phantom keys. Somehow seems more logical.
Named ones confuse me. On few remotes I have Phantom1 has been called DiscreteON and it's confusing if I want to put something totally different there. Not a big deal really, but I thought I'd throw my 5cents in

3FG · Post by **3FG** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 1:37 pm

I'll play. Assuming that a phantom really does perform a known function when called from a macro, e.g Close Caption, then I think it should be called that. Maybe the name could be Ph_CC, with the "Ph" signifying that there is no physical button associated with the function. I think this information is needed to avoid including unnecessary keymoves-- for example, redundantly assigning the CC function to a phantom that already does CC.

I don't see this as confusing-- we already do keymoves on non-phantom functions, and of course those functions are attached to a key, and so carry a meaningful name

Post by **vickyg2003** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:18 pm

Can you confirm a couple, just to be certain?

The only RadioShack that I have "Jp1-able" is my 15-135. So there isn't a lot to test, because the 15-135 has the most complete set of keys.

However, I set the cable to 0749, and assigned Phantom3, Phantom4 to a macro. This sent the expected Page+ and Page- .

The only way I found this out was by looking at the RDF's of all three remotes, which was pretty confusing. Normally I'd vote for calling them Phantom1,2,3, but this really hides a lot of the built in codes from the casual user. The 15-133 is especially limited.

unclemiltie · Post by **unclemiltie** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:35 pm

All of the devices in the three remotes are identical, so in reality if you put a phantom in that is the button that is CC on the 135 with a device that has CC, you will get the CC key. (tihs does not count on the extender with Xshift since we re-use stuff there)

The root of this is that UEI used the same key values, firmware and device upgrades in all three remotes, which gives us this weird setup. in previous remotes, the Phantoms were just unused keys and the probably wouldn't show up in any of the devices. Here they do.

As for renaming, I'm not sure. On one hand, having PhantomPIP would give people the idea that they could use those features on built-in devcies.
however, most people understand phantoms that really have no value and if they use it they would then define something on its keys, so this could be confusing for most who understand what a Phantom is used for.

-bill