IR 8.00 available!

[WagonMaster]

Back to the Firefox issue. In setting up the web-based help entries, I assumed that the default web browser is the executor used to open .htm files. The Firefox issue suggests that is not always the case. Let's go one step further back with the Registry. The lookup for default executors for a file extension is actually a two-stage process. First, HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\.htm is looked up (you can replace .htm by any other extension, but in this case it is .htm). The name under "(Default)" is that of another key, in this case "htmlfile". The executor is then given by the "shell\open\command" subkey of this key. If you still have Firefox 2.0.0.11 reinstalled, could you follow this chain in full when Firefox is your default browser? It seems that the first step might give a different name to "htmlfile" for the second step. IR goes through this two-stage process, so if the first step gave "htmlfile" then your info suggests that the IR web pages should have opened, but using IE instead of Firefox.

Based on your helpful info, I've run some more tests with WinXP-SP2 and Firefox 2.0.0.11. In fact, the 'Default' entry for the [HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\.htm] key does not have "htmlfile" but rather "FirefoxHTML" when Firefox 2.0.0.11 is the default browser. Chasing that key
([HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\FirefoxHTML\shell\open\command]) yields this as the 'Default' setting:

Code: Select all

C:\PROGRA~1\MOZILL~1\FIREFOX.EXE -requestPending -osint -url "%1"

But when I invoke "Help", "JP1 Home Page" in IR8.00 or 8.01dev0 builds, I get the hourglass cursor for about a quarter second and no browser spawns at all. If I manually (i.e. in a command prompt window) invoke that exact string that's shown in the 'Default' key, the browser (Firefox 2.0.0.11) spawns as expected, so I know it's there at the proper spot.

That would be interesting, but it still leaves the other question of whether the default web browser and the executor of .htm files might differ. I've done a web search and got various different answers to how to find the default web browser from the Registry. One of them, which makes logical sense, is what you found: HEKY_CLASSES_ROOT\http\shell\open\command. Certainly that would work with my current setup in Vista. I'll change to use that in IR 8.01 Development Build 1, which I expect to post in a few days. If you could keep your old Firefox installed until you can test that new version, I would be grateful. I'll put a message here when that Build 1 is posted.

That all sounds good. Also, as requested, I'll keep Firefox 2.0.0.11 installed for now. Actually, it's not too difficult to switch between versions, so if there's anything you'd like me to try, just let me know.

Bill

[mathdon]

In fact, the 'Default' entry for the [HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\.htm] key does not have "htmlfile" but rather "FirefoxHTML" when Firefox 2.0.0.11 is the default browser. Chasing that key
([HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\FirefoxHTML\shell\open\command]) yields this as the 'Default' setting:

Code: Select all

C:\PROGRA~1\MOZILL~1\FIREFOX.EXE -requestPending -osint -url "%1"

But when I invoke "Help", "JP1 Home Page" in IR8.00 or 8.01dev0 builds, I get the hourglass cursor for about a quarter second and no browser spawns at all.

I'm beginning to get a glimmer of light about this. I think it is all to do with the quote marks. Firefox 2.0.0.11 is using the MSDOS format for filepaths (the "8.3" format) which means that there cannot be spaces in the path text. Hence no quotes around the pathname. The later Firefox, and MSIE, use long filenames and since these allow spaces, there have to be quotes around the name. IR assumes the name has quotes, which it seeks and removes. As currently written it will get fouled up if they are absent. I'll try to rewrite it so that it can cope with and without quotes. I think that is the real problem, not the issue of whether it follows the .htm filetype or goes to the http key. But just in case, as it makes sense, I will also follow the "http" key in the next version.

Many thanks for your explorations. They have been very helpful and instructive. I think we have nearly got to the bottom of this problem.
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Graham

[WagonMaster]

I'm beginning to get a glimmer of light about this. I think it is all to do with the quote marks.

I hope I haven't been sloppy anywhere about the double-quote marks. At first, I was manually typing what I saw (since the WinXP PC isn't my Internet-facing PC). Later on, I was exporting the registry setting from my WinXP PC directly to my Linux PC so I could (mostly) cut 'n' paste the registry settings. I just hope that I didn't inadvertently miss anything in the process. If anything looks suspicious, don't hesitate to have me re-test and re-report. It sounds like you're on the right track, but I'd hate for a screw-up on my part to send you down a blind alley.

Many thanks for your explorations. They have been very helpful and instructive. I think we have nearly got to the bottom of this problem.

I'm happy to assist in any way I can. Thanks for your hard work!

Bill

[gplncl]

I will investigate the Toolbar overlay issue with Win 98SE if I can, but could you try IR 8.01 Development Build 0. There is an option in it to turn off the To

Bill

I tried the IR 8.01 on my ancient 98SE and the interface work just fine out of the box. No need to adjust registery, or options. Thank you all very much. I tried to open Firefox 3.0 from the help section to get to the jp1 website, and it didn't work. Then I tried the KM icon, and it "couldn't find program" to open KM, and I'm not sure how to tell it "Excel's" location. So, I'm a little mystified. I haven't done a search of this problem yet, so I'll have to look into it.
Again, Thank you all.
Jerry (gplncl)

[The Robman]

You have to use KM first as that will cause the registry to know where KM is, them the IR icon should work.

[mathdon]

Hi, Jerry, thanks for the report. The problem with Firefox and Win98SE was reported earlier by WagonMaster and has been solved in Development Build 1, which will be posted shortly. I sent WagonMaster an early version of Build 1 to test the amendment and he reported that it works. You can find the current state of IR 8.01 in the IR v8.01 wish list thread.

Rob is correct that you need to use KM from outside IR for the registry to know where KM is located, but I don't think that is your problem. The KM icon is greyed out if IR can't find KM. Your problem is that IR can't find Excel and this puzzles me. Can you check if you can open KM outside of IR by double-clicking on the KM file (ie NOT by opening Excel and then opening KM from within Excel)? IR uses the Windows file association data to find the file needed to open ".xls" files, and double-clicking the KM file should cause Windows to do the same thing.

If you can open KM by double-clicking it and IR still will not open it then there is a problem that I need to solve. If KM doesn't open in either of these ways, you need to set the Windows file association for '.xls' files. It's a long time since I used Win98SE so I can't remember how you do this. My oldest reference book is for Win2000Pro. That says you do it by opening Windows Explorer and choosing Tools/Folder Options/File Types from the menu bar.

Please report what you find, whether or not these suggestions solve the problem.
_________________
Graham

[The Robman]

I think, even in Win98SE, that when you click on an unknown file type, Windows asks you what program to use to open it and there's a checkbox for an option to always use this program for this type of file.

However, given that Windows and Excel are both MS programs, I would be very surprised if they let you install Excel without automatically associating it with .xls files.

[mathdon]

In view of Rob's comments it seems likely that double-clicking the KM file WILL open KM (without asking what file to use to do so). So I would be grateful if you could use Regedit.exe to check that the file association is stored in Win98SE in the way I am assuming.

First you need to look up the key HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\.xls and see what name is given under "(Default)". In my case that is Excel.Sheet.8. That name is the name of another key under HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT. You need to look up the "shell\open\command" subkey of this, i.e. in my case I would look up

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Excel.Sheet.8\shell\open\command

Please tell me what is given under "(Default)" for that key. In my case it is

"C:\Program Files\Microsoft Office\Office10\EXCEL.EXE" /e

The other problems with Win98SE have all been to do with the presence or absence of quotation marks, so please make sure you give it exactly as shown by Regedit. Armed with that info I should be able to make sure that IR can parse the registry entry in a way that works for Win98SE as well as more recent versions.
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Graham

[kinggofg]

Just an FYI, I get the exact same "Win98" problem with the missing tabs and messed up widow using Vista and XP (in a VMWare). I will try the dev build, but wanted to point out that this in not just a win98 problem.

(I am using a weird sreen resolution on my lcd tv which is likely causing the problem.)

Update - tested, dev build solves the problem

[mathdon]

Thanks, kinggofg. You are the first user to report this problem with anything other than Win98SE. It is interesting that it is not OS-specific, as I thought. There clearly has to be some rare combination of circumstances that causes it, as there seem only to be a few cases of it happening. But since the development build solves it, I won't worry too much about finding out what they are.
_________________
Graham

[WagonMaster]

There clearly has to be some rare combination of circumstances that causes it, as there seem only to be a few cases of it happening. But since the development build solves it, I won't worry too much about finding out what they are.

I agree with 'mathdon' -- I don't think any further investigation into this oddity is needed at this point, so I'm merely wondering aloud here....

(I am using a weird sreen resolution on my lcd tv which is likely causing the problem.)

The problem with the toolbar position in IR version 8.00, as shown in my screenshot in an earlier post, does occur in Win98SE on a laptop whose full screen size is 800x600 pixels while that problem does not occur in WinXP-SP2 on a laptop whose full screen size is 1280x800. It also does not occur under Linux+Wine running on a 1600x1200 LCD monitor.

In none of those 3 setups does the 'IR.exe' main window occupy the full screen, though, so maybe the screen size/resolution thing is a "red herring". Just wanted to provide some info for the record, in case it ever becomes needed/useful.

Regards,
Bill

[mathdon]

Bill, thanks for the further info about the "tabs hidden by toolbar" problem.

I wonder if you could also help with another Win98SE problem. If you look at my last post in this thread, I was exploring a problem about the KM toolbar button not working on Win98SE that had been raised by Jerry (gplncl). I asked him to let me know the registry entry for the .xls file association (instructions given in that post) but he never replied. I think it is a further issue related to quotation marks, like your earlier ones.

If you have Excel on your Win98SE machine, could you look up that registry entry for me? And if you have Keymap Master on it, could you also tell me whether the KM toolbar button works for you? I never got to the point of discovering whether he has a missing/corrupted registry entry or whether there is yet another file association issue that IR doesn't cope with.
____________________
Graham

[mathdon]

In none of those 3 setups does the 'IR.exe' main window occupy the full screen, though, so maybe the screen size/resolution thing is a "red herring".

A further thought on that issue. The main IR window is re-sizeable (as are the individual panels on the General tab, from IR8.00 on), and the size is preserved from one invocation to the next. So you can try re-sizing the window to fit the screen, to see if the issue is related to that. Incidentally, the default size of the main window, when IR is first installed, is a little less than 800x600 with the intention that it does all show on an 800x600 screen. If you've never re-sized it, does it overflow the sceen by much?
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Graham

[WagonMaster]

I wonder if you could also help with another Win98SE problem. If you look at my last post in this thread, I was exploring a problem about the KM toolbar button not working on Win98SE that had been raised by Jerry (gplncl). I asked him to let me know the registry entry for the .xls file association (instructions given in that post) but he never replied. I think it is a further issue related to quotation marks, like your earlier ones.

If you have Excel on your Win98SE machine, could you look up that registry entry for me?

Actually, I already checked that registry entry when I first saw that issue come up in the thread. I knew I didn't have Excel installed on my Win98SE partition on that laptop, but I thought I'd check it anyway, in case it shed any light. Basically, there was a key named ".XLS" (Note: all capitals as shown, not lowercase) under the "HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT" branch, but the "(default)" entry was null, as I'd somewhat expected. I'd have posted about this, but I figured my data point wasn't helpful and figured that Jerry ('gplncl') would supply you with what you needed.

That laptop (like all my PCs) is used almost exclusively for Linux, so the Win98SE partition is pretty small and very full. But I was able to delete some stuff to free up enough disk space to squeeze a temporary install of Excel (from my "Microsoft Office 97 Small Business Edition" CD) onto that PC.

However, given that Windows and Excel are both MS programs, I would be very surprised if they let you install Excel without automatically associating it with .xls files.

I agree with Rob. And in my case, the association was indeed automatic.

First you need to look up the key HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\.xls and see what name is given under "(Default)". In my case that is Excel.Sheet.8.

With Excel now installed, I checked the key. Just like you, my value is "Excel.Sheet.8". But, as noted above, the key name is (still) ".XLS", not ".xls" (in case that matters).

Chasing the "HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Excel.Sheet.8\shell\Open\command" key yields:

Code: Select all

""C:\Program Files\Microsoft Office\Office\excel.exe" /e"

The above string includes the outer "layer" of double quotes since that's how it appears in the Registry Editor window. In other words, the actual registry key export yields:

Code: Select all

[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Excel.Sheet.8\shell\Open\command]
@=""C:\\Program Files\\Microsoft Office\\Office\\excel.exe" /e"

Hopefully that helps. If not, just holler my way.

And if you have Keymap Master on it, could you also tell me whether the KM toolbar button works for you?

Actually, I don't have KM on it and I've never run it at all, but I figured I'd give it a try since I now have Excel temporarily installed and I might learn something new and expand my horizons while providing your data point....

• I ran IR.exe v8.00 and the "KM" toolbar button was desensitized (as expected). I shut down IR.exe.
• I installed KM v9.17 and ran it, did nothing, and shut it down.
• I re-ran IR.exe v8.00 and the "KM" toolbar button is now sensitized (as expected). I clicked it and it ran Microsoft Excel 97 and (after the prompt about running macros being dangerous) it opened the KM spreadsheet just fine.

I'll leave Excel installed for a while, in case further tests are needed.

I never got to the point of discovering whether he has a missing/corrupted registry entry or whether there is yet another file association issue that IR doesn't cope with.

Yeah, it sure is frustrating when people post with an issue and then don't come back with a follow-up (whether positive or negative). However, given that Jerry's 1st and 2nd posts were separated by 2 weeks, maybe he'll eventually come back to this thread with some details. Where are you, Jerry??? Please provide Graham with the input he needs to help you.

On to the next issue you raised....

In none of those 3 setups does the 'IR.exe' main window occupy the full screen, though, so maybe the screen size/resolution thing is a "red herring".

A further thought on that issue. The main IR window is re-sizeable (as are the individual panels on the General tab, from IR8.00 on), and the size is preserved from one invocation to the next. So you can try re-sizing the window to fit the screen, to see if the issue is related to that. Incidentally, the default size of the main window, when IR is first installed, is a little less than 800x600 with the intention that it does all show on an 800x600 screen. If you've never re-sized it, does it overflow the sceen by much?

I'm not sure I'm following you completely on this one, Graham. Sorry if I'm being dense here....

As I said in my first post about this:

Regardless of how you resize the main window, the icon bar sits atop the tabs, preventing you from accessing any of them.

FYI, the screenshot from that post is with the window maximized, as seen by the "double, nested box" graphic in the upper right corner. Looking back at my post, I didn't make that clear at all -- my apologies.

I played around with it some more, still under Win98SE (800x600 LCD screen), resizing the main window to all sorts of sizes, including fullscreen, initial (non-fullscreen), and various other sizes (both larger and smaller than the default initial window size). I also resized the various panes within the main window (both horizontally and vertically). But, no matter what I did, the toolbar sits atop the tabs and the 1st row of data as shown in my screen capture.

To be thorough, I fired up IR.exe v8.00 under WinXP-SP2 on the other laptop (1280x800 LCD screen). The "toolbar sits atop tabs" problem did not manifest itself for me under those conditions when I did this test a while back. Today, I played around with sizing the main window and the window panes as described above and, unlike 'kinggofg', I could not get it to "break" at all under WinXP-SP2.

If I've missed the intent of your post (or anything else), please let me know.

Hope some of this info proves useful, Graham. As stated earlier, just holler if you need any more info. I'll be happy to run whatever tests you need on any/all of these issues.

Regards,
Bill

[mathdon]

Bill, you are fantastically helpful and cooperative. Many thanks indeed. I won't be able to study all the info you've given me for a day or two, but I will asap and will post the results.
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Graham