toggle command for kenwood vr-309?

dankehoe1 · Post by **dankehoe1** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:46 pm

hi all. i have been out of the scene for a while, i had a rs 15-2116 that i had been using for a year or two. she died the other day.

so i got a sony ax1400 today and am pleased so far. anyway, to the point: I have a kenwood vr-309 rcvr, it has three input selector keys, video, audio, and tv. they each toggle through multiple input choices. (tv1, tv2, tape, cd, dvd, vcr1, vcr2, etc) i want to teach my ax1400 the toggle sets, but it will only learn the first command of the set. how do i get the remote to toggle like the original? i hope i am using the right terminology and have explained what i am trying to accomplish here. thanks, dan.

Capn Trips · Post by **Capn Trips** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 1:18 am

Are you suggesting that the video "toggle" button sends a different discrete input command each time you press it? I've not heard of such a thing.

I would imagine that the cycling occurs within the receiver, not in the remote. i.e. the SAME command sent repeatedly makes the receiver cycle through TV1, TV2, Tape, etc.

Is that not the case?

dankehoe1 · Post by **dankehoe1** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:01 am

yes, that is indeed the case. lets say i am on vcr1, and with the original remote, i press the video select key, i then go to vcr2, etc. so i trained the signal into the new remote, and, if i am on some other video source, the learned key takes me to vcr1, but if i am on vcr1 already, subsequent key presses do nothing. its like the learned signal is specific to vcr1 only.

MaskedMan · Post by **MaskedMan** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:10 am

the sony ax1400 is a terrible remote, if I were you I would drop it to the floor and step on it.

dankehoe1 · Post by **dankehoe1** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 10:32 am

Thanks for your opinion.

Capn Trips · Post by **Capn Trips** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 10:42 am

I'm not very familiar with Kenwood, but wonder if the Kenwood signals use a toggle bit. Try this experiment.

Press the learned VCR input button when it works. Then press some OTHER learned button, then try the learned VCR button again. Does it still not work correctly?

If it does then you need to build an UPGRADE which will correctly deal with toggle bits in the upgrade protocol as no learned signals will ever work consistently for you.

No idea what options you have with the Sony remote to deal with the toggle bit.

Capn Trips · Post by **Capn Trips** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 12:39 pm

Well, looking at OTHER Kenwood upgrades, they seem to use the NEC protocol which has no toggle bit, so perhaps somehow the remote remembers what state the receiver is in and sends a different signal on successive presses.

Have you tried learning successive presses of the OEM toggle buttons to you Sony remote to see if the learned functions are indeed discrete input selections?

Regardless, I see no apparent workaround apart from getting a JP1/JP1.x remote and programming it as you wish.

dankehoe1 · Post by **dankehoe1** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 1:22 pm

hmm, are you suggesting that i have the rekote learn the succesive key presses onto the same key? wouldnt that just overwrite previous learned signals?

Capn Trips · Post by **Capn Trips** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 1:24 pm

No. I'm suggesting that you learn successive presses onto DIFFERENT keys, to see if they are TRULY different signals.

i.e. you can then press in in DIFFERENT sequences to see if they ALWAYS take you to th same input, or whether it is something remembered in the RECEIVER.

dankehoe1 · Post by **dankehoe1** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 4:18 pm

well, it seems to be discrete signals in the remote. i.e.: if i hit the input key three times, it goes: vcr1, vcr2, dvd. if i hit it twice then delay for a second or two, it goes vcr1, vcr2, then back to vcr1. so it resets to vcr1 signal if it doesn't send a subsequent signal in x amount of time. so, i trained different buttons as you said with signals from the original remote, but, in order to get the discrete signal i wanted for the specific input, i physically blocked the signals i didn't want and allowed the ax1400 to learn the appropriate subsequent signal. it would still be nice to have one key that toggled, but it seems the discrete codes are remote dependent and not receiver dependent.

Capn Trips · Post by **Capn Trips** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 12:54 am

So when you press the key to which the learned the "third" successive keypress, it ALWAYS selects DVD?

That is indeed weird.

Interestingly, th "toggle" behaviour taht you seek is usually the reverse of what people come to this forum seeking. Most people seem to PREFER discrete behaviour - for ease of use in Device selection and device setup macros.

To each his own, I suppose.

I have no further ideas for you with you non-JP1 remote.