IR 6.00 Release Candidate 3 Now Available

mpauker · Post by **mpauker** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 5:37 pm

I see.

It wouldn't be a big deal to add it, but I'm still not sure why it would be valuable. It's on the KeyMove page because that IS the value of the KeyMove. (The EFC is simply a scrambled form of the same KeyMove.)

There is no HexCmd on the Macros page because IR is able to display the complete meaning of the macro by displaying the key names. Likewise, IR is displaying the complete meaning of the SP Function, so as far as I can tell, there's no reason to show the Hex. (If IR encounters a special function that it doesn't recognize, then it DOES display the value as Hex.)

Can you explain how you'd use the HexCmd in conjunction with SP Functions? If that's valuable, would it also be valuable with respect to the Macros tab?

e34m5 · Post by **e34m5** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 6:12 pm

I askes the same question about when I did 5.0. The answer was overwhelming for the HEX.

There are still people who may want to use the Excel spreadsheet and then copy the Hex Commands into IR.

As you say since it's not hard to do.......

Post by **The Robman** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 6:29 pm

Here's another option you can put on the "to do" list for consideration.

UEI sometimes makes remotes without numeric buttons. The user manual will list codes that only contain the digits 1,2,3 and 4, then to program these setup codes into these remotes you use the VOL+/- and CH+/- buttons, where VOL+ = 1, VOL- = 2, CH+ = 3 and CH- = 4.

These funny setup codes are actually a base4 representation of the normal setup codes (just subtract 1 from each digit), so setup code 111234 is really 000123 in base4, which converts to 0027.

Maybe you could add an option to the RDFs where if it's checked, IR would display the setup codes in this pseudo-base4 style. Of course, I would then ask for an option to override this!

Post by **ElizabethD** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 9:17 pm

First of all, thanks for the improvements you've done to IR. Is really nice

.
Now to the HEX issue:

mpauker wrote:Can you explain how you'd use the HexCmd in conjunction with SP Functions? If that's valuable, would it also be valuable with respect to the Macros tab?

Several reasons/explanations applying to me:
1. Extender instructions for 8910 and 7800c7 speak strict hex for good reason. While IR builder of SP and the display help along to use those instructions, I still like to have that concrete, final, feedback of the bits being set the way I intended.
2. EC use. Excel. I've got ideas sitting in Excel. In hex

believe me. I'd like to synchronize what comes out with what I think it says.
3. Yellow stickies with hex numbers all over the place. I can't easily square them with good English words without those numbers.

I can't comment about macros. I can't think of the need here, since the only way I've built macros are dropping key names not hex numbers into a list. Hmm... If I remember otherwise, I'll post a retraction. You'll need to ask the experts. The only use I can think of hex values here is to make snooping through the raw data easier by being able to anchor onto more specific items.

BTW, the new SP format dictates further changes in EC's keymoves sheet.

Post by **The Robman** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 10:42 pm

Basically, she's saying that she's such a geek that she has a much easier time reading hex than she does English words. This is partially my fault as I asked her to sort through all the Panasonic audio codes and compile a list.

mpauker · Post by **mpauker** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 8:05 am

The Robman wrote:Maybe you could add an option to the RDFs where if it's checked, IR would display the setup codes in this pseudo-base4 style. Of course, I would then ask for an option to override this!

Does this apply mostly to old remotes, or is it something that UEI is just beginning to do? (Just trying to see where it fits on the priority list.) This wouldn't be a particularly complex task, but it might be somewhat time-consuming because that part of the code isn't encapsulated particularly well.

mpauker · Post by **mpauker** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 8:23 am

ElizabethD wrote:Several reasons/explanations applying to me:
1. Extender instructions for 8910 and 7800c7 speak strict hex for good reason. While IR builder of SP and the display help along to use those instructions, I still like to have that concrete, final, feedback of the bits being set the way I intended.
2. EC use. Excel. I've got ideas sitting in Excel. In hex believe me. I'd like to synchronize what comes out with what I think it says.
3. Yellow stickies with hex numbers all over the place. I can't easily square them with good English words without those numbers.

Your first issue requires only that the grid (and summary page) be changed to display the hex values. This is what I was referring to when I said that it wouldn't be a big deal to do. At the same time, I still don't see much value in displaying the hex just so people can be reassured that IR is working correctly.

On the other hand, the fact that hex data will still be coming from EC makes your request much more persuasive. Unfortunately, addressing this requires that the special protocol form be updated to allow either formatted or unformatted (hex) entries. That's a bigger task, but probably not too bad. I'll look into it.

BTW, the new SP format dictates further changes in EC's keymoves sheet.

I don't know what this means.

Post by **The Robman** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 9:22 am

mpauker wrote:
The Robman wrote:Maybe you could add an option to the RDFs where if it's checked, IR would display the setup codes in this pseudo-base4 style. Of course, I would then ask for an option to override this!
Does this apply mostly to old remotes, or is it something that UEI is just beginning to do? (Just trying to see where it fits on the priority list.) This wouldn't be a particularly complex task, but it might be somewhat time-consuming because that part of the code isn't encapsulated particularly well.

Consider it very LOW priority. UEI has been using the pseudo-base4 for setup codes for ages, but for the most part the remotes that qualify for it are not JP1 compatible. So far there are only remote that I've come across that uses these codes and is JP1 compatible is the URC-6541 "Audio Zapper" from Europe, but I suspect that most of their "zapper" remotes would also qualify.

Post by **ElizabethD** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 11:38 am

The Robman wrote: ... she has a much easier time reading hex than she does English words

Rob, geek thing NOT fair, there goes my reputation

Nothing against Queen's English here, it's just that no provisions for setting bit-level flags...

mpauker wrote: addressing this [EC] requires that the special protocol form be updated to allow either formatted or unformatted (hex) entries

While I'm not sure what formatted vs unformatted is, here is my 5cents on EC use:
EC expects special protocols fields and hex values for translation. The same data that's on the keymoves sheet. The translation part is now somewhat redundant since IR6 does it nicely. The fact that special protocols are separate is not at issue either. However, in EC you can do global find/replace on multiple items in one shot as well as sorts. Herein lies the value, even in the absence of the advertised 'bulk' reloading.
I'll drop issue 1. I hear you, it is cosmetic, and one can live without it.

mpauker · Post by **mpauker** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 12:04 pm

I'm still not completely following all of the issues... probably because I don't have much experience with EC. Nonetheless, I've added the option to enter hex (rather than using the SP-specific controls) for SP values. (Is that one of the things you're looking for?) I've also added a HexCmd column to the SP tab and the Summary page. Will this take care of your issue?

Post by **ElizabethD** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 12:15 pm

mpauker wrote: I've added the option to enter hex (rather than using the SP-specific controls) for SP values. (Is that one of the things you're looking for?) I've also added a HexCmd column to the SP tab and the Summary page. Will this take care of your issue?

Sounds great to me

many thanks, but you didn't, I hope, kill entry by key names.
Re:EC - I'm out of place here, just meddling. Let the EC authors call the shots.

mpauker · Post by **mpauker** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 1:20 pm

ElizabethD wrote:you didn't, I hope, kill entry by key names.

It's an option. If you check the "Hex" checkbox, then the Hex edit control is displayed (and everything else is grayed out). If the Hex checkbox is unchecked then it will work the same as it currently does in RC3. Note that the Hex is not validated, so if the user adds 2 bytes where there should only be 1, IR will still accept it. (I think that this is good because it allows values to be entered (albeit not too easily) even if I screw up some aspects of a SP implementation.)

I'd like to give people a bit more time to work with RC3 to see if any new bugs are found. Towards that end, I'll probably wait a few days to post the new build and make that the official 6.00 release.

Post by **ElizabethD** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 8:55 pm

mpauker wrote: If you check the "Hex" checkbox, then the Hex edit control is displayed (and everything else is grayed out). If the Hex checkbox is unchecked then it will work the same as it currently does in RC3...

Sounds wonderful, thanks so much

Can't wait to see it. Your solution offers the best of both worlds!

mpauker wrote: I'd like to give people a bit more time to work with RC3 to see if any new bugs are found. Towards that end, I'll probably wait a few days to post the new build and make that the official 6.00 release.

Now, I just got into it (RC3) and see another thing to pick on if I may.
While the rtf format in Summary is pretty cool, the same idea in a standard .txt file from Summary as well as the three other sheets (via the clip/copy button) is a bit of a problem in subsequent use. The issue is that some data ends up broken up into separate rows. For instance this is how broken cells come out in excel:

Code: Select all

Row1		Type				Note
Row2		ToadTog(0,To		
Row3		ggle)		
Row4		SHIFT-0			simulated DiscrOn+stdPower to 
Row5						    shut off

I’d rather see two rows for functions instead of four.
The text seems split on space or end of word, while it would be better if it were all in one continuous stream which we can wordwrap when we so wish. Can you squeeze this one in between your other challenges, please?

Sorry to be a bother. I’m not too happy about it myself, ‘cause I realize that the intention of this new IR was adapting IR to new remotes ,and not this sort of items. It’s just that I bumped into this moments ago and figured it’s better to report now than when you’re all done.

mpauker · Post by **mpauker** » Sat Dec 18, 2004 8:16 am

The problem is that Delphi has very limited support for RichEdit controls, and I haven't been able to figure out how to implement columns. I'm literally breaking the strings myself, which is why you're having trouble pasting.

There are 3 options here. I could figure out how to add columns, I could provide an option to disable the line breaks (in which case the display would look awful but it would paste correctly), or I could leave it as is. Obviously I'd like to do the first, but I'm not sure how to go about it. In the meantime I'll consider the second.

Post by **ElizabethD** » Sat Dec 18, 2004 12:53 pm

mpauker wrote: I could provide an option to disable the line breaks (in which case the display would look awful but it would paste correctly).

This, middle, option which disables line breaks, is an only option for the key moves, special functions and macros (, fav/scan?) as pasting data elsewhere calls for single tabs between the fields (which you have), and no other control characters within any field. Thanks for considering the awful look

If it’s cost effective ,the switch you propose could be a slick feature for Summary.