device combiner for URC6440/OARUSB04 ?

[tranx]

In the glossary 'Device Combiner' is described:

An protocol that allows you to create one setup code that combines several different types of signals and assign it to a single device button. The combiner can free up keymove/macro space, but takes up a large amount of upgrade space. The combiner lets you specify the duration for signal, which may improve their performance in macros. The device combiner can only work with protocol executors that use 3 digit EFCs.

These simpleset remotes have only 4 devices and relatively few buttons but shifted functions can be used in macros (although there is no shift button), and DSMs are available with JP1. OARUSB04 also has 22 phantom buttons per device.
They do use 3 digit EFCs, and appear to have plenty of free space so, while looking through the glossary, it seemed that a device combiner might be particularly useful.
It is early days for their JP1 development but, now that RM can be used, would it be feasible, please?

[mdavej]

With plenty of keymove/macro memory, we don't really need the combiner anymore. You can already assign any function from any device to any button. It was more useful in the old days when JP1 remotes had very little keymove/macro memory but plenty of upgrade memory.

I think the definition above is misleading. Note that it says combine into a single device button, meaning not several functions per button, rather commands from several devices mixed together into the same device upgrade. So the combiner doesn't really provide more multi-function keys like it seems to imply. The exact same thing can be accomplished with keymoves and macros.

Something that would be useful that we have in extenders is long press and double press functionality. That way you really could put more functions on a single button. The skip buttons have long and short press functionality already. Not sure if any other buttons do too by default.

Hope that makes sense.

[tranx]

mdavej thanks. It appears my problem is that I would like to use 6 devices. Because 2 happen to share the same protocols etc. they can already be mixed in one of the 4 available device 'slots', leaving 4 still to be somehow accommodated in the remaining 3 device slots.

Although I don't understand how multi-function keys could be done with with keymoves and macros, I am not really looking for multi-function keys, 'just' a method for mixing commands from two devices, by combining two (or more?) devices into one, so it could be loaded into RM when it only had room for one device.

The bit in the definition: "A protocol that allows you to create one setup code that combines several different types of signals and assign it to a single device button." seemed to me to say, just as you put it, "...commands from several devices mixed together into the same device upgrade", which is actually what I think I want.

It seems I cannot load more than 4 upgrades into RM unless I had some extra 'dev's (as seen in other remotes) or unless I could somehow 'mix commands (from two devices) together into the same device upgrade'

In case it is relevant, two of the upgrades share NEC1, although some other details are not the same:

...................HumaxPVR9300........FoxsatHDR
setup code...........0176....................2010
protocol...............NEC1....................NEC1
Protocol ID...........00 5A...................00 5A
Sub device...........16.........................49
Fixed data............20 FF F7...............20 FF 73

[mdavej]

Don't confuse the limited number of device selection buttons with the number of devices you can have residing in the remote. You can add as many device upgrades as you want, yet not assign their setup codes to a device button. Then you can use keymoves to combine functions with an existing device.

So in your case, go ahead and add both the Humax and Foxsat devices, but don't assign Foxsat to a device button. Then simply go to the keymove tab and add the few Foxsat commands you need to some spare buttons (numpad or colored buttons possibly?) to the Bound Key Device your Humax is assigned to.

[tranx]

Don't confuse the limited number of device selection buttons with the number of devices you can have residing in the remote. You can add as many device upgrades as you want, yet not assign their setup codes to a device button...

Excellent...in fact the Tv, 2xHumax PVRs, and Roberts Radio were already in, so after pressing 'New' in the device tab, I 'opened' the (already mixed) Panasonic device (DMREX-85+BTT360) and pressed 'cancel' instead of assigning it to a device button, and there it was in the list! Thank you very much.

I could then distribute the functions with keymoves and macros, as you said.

[tranx]

The resulting image, +Roberts 83i device not currently in use, which so far seems to work fine https://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... e_id=12741

[mathdon]

These simpleset remotes have only 4 devices and relatively few buttons but shifted functions can be used in macros (although there is no shift button), and DSMs are available with JP1

I have acquired many remotes in the course of my development work but the URC-6440 is the first that has tempted me away, for actual home use, from my trusty URC-7781 that got me into this forum in the first place. So I intend to do my best to make it work the way I want.

I can guarantee that a shift key will be coming. I intend also to look into long key press and into extending the number of device buttons. I am open to suggestions as to other additions that would be useful. Additions won't be in the form of a conventional extender, but instead in the form of a replacement reset simpleset.com file into which you can add the .rmir file saved from your existing setup.

[tranx]

Mathdon, very good news, especially that shift and more devices could be coming in the form of a simpleset file. Meanwhile the DSMs have been extremely useful.

Could the Device buttons carry some extra Devices in shift mode? it would be a luxury to be able to put commands etc on them, and if possible to address some quirks, noticed so far only with OARUSB04G, where at present I don't think the AudioInput button ('Text' on 6440), and perhaps List, can have commands put on them.

In RM, Activities, Activity functions section, not sure what effect the ticks for 'Power?' in each device have, but can't seem to get power commands to work in Activity modes. Perhaps it is to do with the original MacroPower functions, or have I missed something obvious again?

When the usb was disconnected too soon, which scrambled things, was glad the original settings.bin had been saved; copying that to the remote put it right again.

A recently acquired 6440 turned out to be R00, not R01 as the others which I have collected. It was dusty even inside the plastic wrapping and took a few button presses to get them working consistently. In use, the only difference seems to be that it takes a bit longer to get connected with USB. When it was not recognised as R01, was grateful to find there is an rdf for R00 too! Have marked the body of the remote because from the outside it is only the sticker in the battery cover which distinguishes it.

[The Robman]

Tranx, here's some background on the Device Combiner, and another add-on called the Device Multiplexor, for you:

Device Combiner:
This tool lets you combine functions from multiple upgrades into a single upgrade. It was primarily useful for 2 reasons:
1. If you have a device that uses a mixture of different signals, and there isn't an existing executor that allows you to combine them.
2. You want one device mode to control multiple devices, for example, maybe the volume buttons work your stereo, the transport buttons work your DVD player and some other buttons work your TV.

Both of the above can also be achieved using keymoves, so it's a question of which provides the best usage of the remote's memory.

Device Multiplexor:
This tool was invented for people who don't have enough device buttons on their remote to work all of their devices. The idea here was that you could set aside some other "spare" buttons to be additional device buttons. So, for example, if your remote has coloured buttons, you could program (let's say) a Tivo and a DVD player to the DVD button. You could then program RED to be Tivo and BLUE to be DVD. Then, to use the Tivo, you would press DVD followed by RED and to use the DVD player, you would press DVD followed by BLUE. That way, the two coloured buttons are sort-of "sub-device" buttons, and they would only have that meaning when the remote is in DVD mode. In TV mode, they could be programmed to do something completely different.

The remote remembers who you left it previously, so if you use the lat time you used the remote, you used it to watch a DVD, next time you press the DVD button it will still work the DVD player. So the multiplexor is also a good way to include devices on the remote that you don't use much.

[tranx]

Rob, thanks for the notes about those add-ons. The sub-device idea is a neat solution. When buttons are in short supply I came across the principle that in some situations the same button can be used to toggle between states e.g. a pair of DSMs on the same button, to go back and forth between frequently used devices and inputs etc., or an ordinary macro e.g. for Home Theatre on/off, including an IR Lime mains switch. First in the sequence PwrToggle does nothing if the mains is already off, pause, then the Lime turns the mains on to start the HT winding up and CEC does the rest, for better sound. The next time, Pwr is toggled off, pause, and Lime off to shut the mains down, and perhaps to put out some of the displays in the bedroom. As you rightly said, JP1 is more fun than Harmony

[mathdon]

Tranx, I'm really glad that you have an R00 version as well as an R01. It may be very helpful for testing what I produce. You should be able to load an R01 settings.bin file into the R00 version and it will be recognised by RMIR as R01. However, I have discovered that there still may be differences in unadvertised behaviour.

The situation where I have found this is the 998 command. On the R01 this is a blink-back of some serial number, i.e. if you do a long press of Setup, then 998, then press the digit keys 1 to 5 in order and count the flashes, you get 24001. This is not the signature, I don't know what it is. The 983 command reads back the signature, as 25701 (note that the 5th digit of the signature 257001 is hidden).

If you try this, you must not leave much time between the end of the flashes for one digit, and pressing the next one. I found that natural except for digit 4, where if you wait too long to realise that the number of flashes is 0, then it times out and you don't get the one flash for digit 5.

I think you will find that for the R00 version, with an R00 settings.bin the 998 command is not recognised. I would be interested to know what happens with the R00 version with an R01 settings.bin file. I don't think it will work and it may crash the remote and cause a factory reset, so make sure you have a backup if you try it.

This is surprising to me, as the simpleset.com website does not know what version you have when you download a reset settings.bin file. So I thought that the R01 settings.bin reset file would upgrade an R00 remote in all details. It seems that it may not do so for some unadvertised features, though.

[tranx]

Ok,
Connected R00, went to simpleset.com from the link in the popup, (no upload done)
- saved a reset settings.bin and copied it into R00
- two blinks after 998: no blink back with #1, subsequently a single blink with 3,4,5 etc.

Connected R00, went to simpleset.com from the link in the popup, and did an upload
- modified watchTv and 'downloaded' (saved the settings.bin and copied it into R00)
- again two blinks after 998: no blink back with #1, subsequently a single blink with 3,4,5 etc.

Connected R01, went to simpleset.com from the link in the popup, did an upload
- modified WatchTv and 'downloaded' it (saved the settings.bin and copied it into R00)
- The long press of Setup lit the setup button for the first second or two while it was pressed but did not eventually evince a double blink.
- After that TV button continued blinking every second or two i.e. it seemed to have been crashed, as you predicted
- a long wait before USB connected as reported, and a bit frightening this time, but then RMIR (R00) still said 'The signature of the attached remote does not match the signature you are trying to upload'

Copied a saved factory settings.bin, which restored the R00 so an earlier R00 setup could be uploaded to it with RMIR, and the remote seemed to work normally again.

...I would be interested to know what happens with the R00 version with an R01 settings.bin file.

Connected R01, went to simpleset.com from the link in the popup, did an upload, with the same result as if no upload was made:-
- clicked 'Restore Remote' and saved the settings.bin and copied it into R00)
- 998 seemed to work but pressing #1 started the button flashing every 1/2 sec until the batteries were removed. Crashed by 998?
- After putting the batteries back the remote seemed ok again.
- trying an 01 image: an 01 RMIR image could be uploaded (as if the R00 remote was an R01) and seems to work normally.

Again copied the saved factory settings.bin to the R00 remote, to get it back as it was.

Noticed R00 label says 'MAXQ622X-2549+E'
.......................cf R01: 'MAXQ622X-2570+E'

[tranx]

...You should be able to load an R01 settings.bin file into the R00 version and it will be recognised by RMIR as R01....

- confirmed

...However, I have discovered that there still may be differences in unadvertised behaviour...I would be interested to know what happens with the R00 version with an R01 settings.bin file. I don't think it will work and it may crash the remote...

- confirmed

...This is surprising to me, as the simpleset.com website does not know what version you have when you download a reset settings.bin file. So I thought that the R01 settings.bin reset file would upgrade an R00 remote in all details. It seems that it may not do so for some unadvertised features, though.

Here is the R00 factory settings.bin, together with R00 settings.bin after the generic 6440 reset settings.bin has been copied into R00 6440
https://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... e_id=12747

[yaworski]

Noticed R00 label says 'MAXQ622X-2549+E'
.......................cf R01: 'MAXQ622X-2570+E'

Mine says MAXQ622X-2553+ E. This is R00.

BTW I'm getting the same effect with 998.

On settings.bin file with 255304 signature (original from R00) the 998 code is being rejected.
On settings.bin file with 257001 signature (R01 from simpleset.com) the code is accepted but by pressing 1 the firmware goes into an infinite loop with the LED blinking and the remote is unresponsive (even the USB connection) until the battery is removed.

[tranx]

... I am open to suggestions as to other additions that would be useful...

It seems that JP1 and the punch throughs make the Combi buttons redundant except, if only for two devices, to be able to access to buttons for their 'non-macro' functions, so perhaps they could be freed up.
Especially if granted a Shift button somewhere, which would use up one of the newly spare buttons, the other spare button might still be used for access to the non-macro, unshifted, buttons:-

If two or more combi modes could be added, up to the new number of device modes, a single button 'n' could switch to the relevant 'non-macro' mode with a DSM:-

From the RMIR DSM set up list which currently only offers 'WatchTv' and 'WatchMovie' in the list of functions, in each device the user could then set up a DSM on the button 'n' as follows
In device mode #1:- non-macro1
In device mode #2:- non-macro2
etc.

If feasible, perhaps the buttons Setup and Learn could be for 'Shift' and 'Non-Macro'.

and if the device buttons could carry macros as well